] Malcolm Collins: everybody complains that as we’ve broken down our sense of community, that it’s removed the opportunity[00:00:06] Simone Collins: forTo bully and[00:00:07] Malcolm Collins: terrorize[00:00:07] friendships, for, you know, love, for a sense of community. But it also removed the ability for people who get turned on by, like, cheating with people and then harassing their spouses from having a community of, like, mean girls they can do that with, right? Yeah. So they’ve had to reinvent these spaces for the new world of the internet.[00:00:29] Would you like to know more?[00:00:31] Malcolm Collins: Hello, Simone. Today we will be talking about an incident that the Mary Sue, the Mary Sue, the most leftist, you know, degenerate thing you can imagine, right?[00:00:43] As a, as a news article.[00:00:44] Simone Collins: Okay.[00:00:45] Malcolm Collins: Their title on this is what I can only describe as pure degeneracy, Proud Cheaters Sued For Allegedly Using A Cheating Coach Business To Bully Betrayed Spouses.[00:01:01] Simone Collins: Wow. I mean, whoa. I... Wait[00:01:07] The, no, th- this is peak girl... No, this is, okay, I- I’ve come to a conclusion. The, the gear has to finish processing. This is peak girl boss feminism, right? Because what you saw was a whole bunch of influencers all selling their courses, and all the courses on legitimate things, well, they ran out. And so then they went to MLMs, but then all the ML- MLMs, like, they ran out.[00:01:25] Like, they, they’ve gone bankrupt or become scandalous or people have gotten smart to it. So the only thing left for them to sell courses on is cheating.[00:01:34] Malcolm Collins: And the communities that they created, for some examples of the what we’ll get into here- Okay ... and what, what we’ll be able to take away from, ‘cause it’s important to try to learn some lesson from this, avoid this, et cetera, right?[00:01:48] Simone Collins: What’s the lesson? Maybe don’t create a course on how to cheat?[00:01:52] Malcolm Collins: Well, so they would go into the private paid community for cheating women and share stuff like stories about how they had slept with the partner while the other partner was, like, asleep i- in the bed or in the same[00:02:07] Simone Collins: house. Oh.[00:02:07] Malcolm Collins: Or-[00:02:08] Simone Collins: This is a, is this like a cuck thing?[00:02:10] Malcolm Collins: Or that they had used the other partner’s sex toys, or that they had taken pictures of the original partner that included their kids and put them next to pictures of herself[00:02:23] To ask which is more attractive in the community. Like, and th- this is what eventually caused the lawsuit was all the shared private information. But it’s a fascinating phenomenon that I wanted to dig into, that it has even mortified the Mary Sue. And it’s been developing for a while.[00:02:44] It’s been developing as a situation over a number of years. People have been covering it for a number of years, but now we basically have the full story and where things are. All right?[00:02:52] Simone Collins: Well.[00:02:53] Malcolm Collins: So Chelsea Smallwood, a TikTok creator who made being a cheater her entire platform, is now facing a lawsuit after her cheating business shared private information and betrayed spouses to further bully and mock them.[00:03:05] Now note here this is from the Mary Sue article, so you know it’s maximum lefty slop here. They’re... I, I’m not pulling any punches. And what’s also fascinating about this is, is what it really appeared to be. When they talk about bully and mocking them you say, “Is this a cuck fetish?” It appeared to genuinely be a fetish, a, a fetish around basically the other side of an NTR fetish, like getting turned on by the thought of humiliating somebody’s partner by sleeping with their, their partner.[00:03:35] Yeah ... a- a- and in that way, the paid community where they could, without judgment, talk about this the, the, that sort of heightened the erotic nature of what they were doing in their[00:03:54] Simone Collins: mind. Yeah, they seemed... They, they liked this. It wasn’t like, “Oh, phew, I’m glad I got away with that.”[00:03:58] Malcolm Collins: Well, yeah- It was- And [00:04:00] we’ll go over.[00:04:00] It’s also very funny, like what a, what a cheating coach does. Like, the idea that she would like sit down with these people and like talk them through like all the emotional parts of, of cheating with some- Right? Like, you need a psychologist for this, but somebody who won’t judge you, right? So you talk through the emotions of like, “Well, is he spending too much time with her?”[00:04:25] It’s like, well, it is his wife.[00:04:29] Simone Collins: Oh, I thought it was for practical things, like make sure that you guys communicate using this app, and if you wanna receive gift from, gifts from him, make sure that you do it this way so the wife doesn’t find out or things like that. The, no, the[00:04:40] Malcolm Collins: core thing seemed to be about like the bragging and humiliating part.[00:04:43] Simone Collins: Mm-hmm.[00:04:44] Malcolm Collins: But there was stuff on like how to get around tracking apps and stuff like that, and we’ll, we’ll get around that, onto that. So Smallwood started gaining traction on the social, on social media for posting, quote-unquote, “cheating content,” calling herself The Other Woman and the Wife.[00:04:58] She made several TikTok videos bragging about her affair. One such video was titled Things Your Husband Did While He Was in an Affair With Me. In the video, she dances joyously while bragging about things she and her cheating partner did, such as going on a trip with her on his and his wife’s anniversary and setting up a secret bank account to hide all the trips and gifts he was buying Smallwood.[00:05:21] Smallwood made dozens of similar TikToks talking unapologetically about her affair and demonizing victims of cheating, claiming it was relatable affair content. She eventually decided to turn The Other Woman and Wife into a business featuring podcasts, retreats, and private communities for cheaters to congregate and exchange tips and resources.[00:05:45] And I’ll post a video of one of her TikToks here so you guys can get an idea of what these looked like.[00:05:50] Speaker 9: Phone while he was with me, and I could hear everything.[00:05:53] Lied to you repeatedly about where he was. And again, just to check in on the video that she’s posting with, it’s her cheersing while she drinks cocktails with this music. Didn’t tell you the actual full truth when you caught him. “Technically I cheated. I will admit that. I turned away from my spouse of three years and I hurt him because of that choice, but that doesn’t mean I define myself as a cheater.[00:06:14] To this day, I reject the motto of once a cheater, always a cheater. It’s reductionist and judgemental.”[00:06:20] Malcolm Collins: She isn’t the first person to have the idea of turning cheating into a business platform. , From Smallwood to Ashley Madison to the incest spotlight on Amie Roach or TJ Holmes, there have long been pushes to normalize infidelity, provide resources to cheaters, and profit off of affairs.[00:06:37] However, normalizing infidelity wasn’t Smallwood’s only mission. She took things to another level when she allegedly attempted to make cyberbullying and harassment of victims’ infidelity part of the business, too. Chelsea Smallwood and Her Businesses Sued by Cheating Victim. Part of The Other Woman and the Wife actually a coaching business.[00:06:54] Smallwood, who has a BA in economics, has no qualifications to serve as a l- life coach or counselor. I love when leftists gatekeep around counseling. Yet her website has an application form in which individuals can get one-on-one coaching. Oh, no. You’d say, basically The Mary Sue’s problem here is that she wasn’t...[00:07:19] To teach women how to better cheat on their husbands, that she needed to be a licensed psychologist. Like, that seems to be, for them, the bigger problem. Like, how dare she? I, I would assume, actually, that a woman who spends her entire career talking about cheating would know more about cheating than a psychologist would, right?[00:07:45] Like-[00:07:45] Simone Collins: Truly. No, I- if I wanted to cheat on you, Malcolm, I, and I wanted a coach for it, I would probably go with the woman who cheats a lot, l- allegedly. Yeah, I mean- I guess I’d want proof of the cheating, ‘cause we don’t know this is all just some rage bait she made up [00:08:00] to get followers.[00:08:01] Malcolm Collins: Oh, no, no, no, no. The relationships broke up, everything like that.[00:08:04] We’ll go over it. Oh,[00:08:05] Simone Collins: okay, okay. Well, as long as she has a track record.[00:08:07] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. I mean, I don’t know how much track record she, she had after she became the cheating woman, right? Like, I, I’d, I’d have some questions about that. Like, I, I... Especially dating her or something, like it’s gonna come out eventually, right?[00:08:23] And- No, I mean, that’s how one of the, the person who found out about this found out is they joined her community to find their husband on it being posted by one of the other members of the community. Now she says she joined it ‘cause she was suspicious, but we’ll see. We’ll see. Hmm. One of the coaches working with Smallwood was Olivia Nicodermus, who had an affair with her best friend and neighbor’s husband.[00:08:46] Things took an ugly turn when Nicodermus allegedly began using the Other Woman community to share private information about Kristin Jacobs, the victim of her affair. Oh, great. I, I love it’s, like, their best fair- friend and everything like that, right? Like, Jacobs has filed a lawsuit against the Other Woman and the wife Smallwood and Nicodermus, seeking damages after Smallwood and Nicodermus allegedly used the cheating business to encourage the harassment of her.[00:09:10] After learning of her husband Nicodermus’ affair, Jacobs started researching the Other Woman and the wife, and was horrified when she stumbled on a TikTok reel of Smallwood reading her private text messages about her affair out loud, word per word. In an attempt to find out how Smallwood got this information, Jacobs anonymously joined the Other Woman community and saw Nicodermus had been posting private information, including identifying information like her full name, pictures of her children, and even disclosed details of private health matters.[00:09:40] The information and text messages were allegedly posted publicly so that other cheaters in the community could mock, bully, and harass Jacobs for being a victim. Oh. But that’s not why. They know why. It’s because it turned the person on to share the information. Like, the humiliation was part of it for this, and to prove that they’d actually done it.[00:09:56] Like you said, how do you know they’re really doing it, right?[00:09:59] Simone Collins: Yeah, so hold on. I wonder, so when you wrote The Pragmatist’s Guide to Sexuality, you described some people as really only being able to become to be aroused by people with whom they had a strong emotional connection. Which actually explains rule 34, because, like, you know, you grew up watching Daphne on Scooby-Doo.[00:10:16] And so now, you know, you- You need to, whatever. We’re not gonna get into that, right? But like- Yeah ... maybe there’s this, this cheating, there’s k- some kind of weird perversion of that particular pattern whereby you can only really feel something if you’re hurting someone who you deeply, like, know, like your best friend.[00:10:34] Malcolm Collins: Well, well cheating in males, generally speaking,[00:10:38] Simone Collins: Yeah ...[00:10:38] Malcolm Collins: for[00:10:39] Simone Collins: a lot of- Well, cheating in males just seems like, look, men are like-[00:10:41] Malcolm Collins: There’s like an obvious biological reason to cheat in[00:10:43] Simone Collins: males. Yes. Women, it’s different. Women, it’s weird.[00:10:46] Malcolm Collins: Right. But it makes sense that sometimes females may get parts of a male arousal pattern.[00:10:53] That’s- Hmm ... what this looks like to me. Hmm. And in addition, think about the things that she’s showing off. They’re all, they’re not, “The sex is so good.” They’re things like, “He took me on a vacation. He has a private bank account[00:11:07] Simone Collins: which he gave me gifts.” No, so I think, I think it’s about the self-validation that I could get this male to spend resources on me, even though it’s against[00:11:13] Malcolm Collins: you.[00:11:13] Well, no, that, that’s the point, right? And that is- Hmm ... something that many women would value from an evolutionary perspective, right? Like-[00:11:18] Simone Collins: Yes. No, for sure. Yes.[00:11:19] Malcolm Collins: And they would be- ... get a man to give you more stuff. Yeah. I get...[00:11:24] Simone Collins: So the affair isn’t even, it’s not even really about the intimate stuff that happens.[00:11:30] Yeah. Okay. Yes.[00:11:32] Malcolm Collins: However, it got worse. In the lawsuit, Jacobs claims that Smallwood encouraged Nicodemus to publicly admit to horrific acts, such as bragging about spying on Jacobs during intimate moments with her husband, and using Jacobs’ sex toys on herself without consent. The TikTok influencer, The Dadvocate, summed up the law piece best, stating that Smallwood, Nicodemus, and their company are being sued for what I can only describe as pure degeneracy.[00:11:55] Simone Collins: That’s why you shouldn’t have sex toys, ‘cause you never know what could be happening to [00:12:00] them.[00:12:01] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. And the, and The Dadvocate had noted how a lot of online sleuths have been very important to this. However, she didn’t act quickly enough, as users found because she tried to remove her TikTok, oh, she wiped her TikTok.[00:12:12] Well, hopefully I can still find some stuff. Oh, no. No, no, no. People have clipped it. Evidence to prove Jacob’s claims. Yeah. They found a public comment from Nicodemus offering to give a user a comparison photo to prove she was better looking than Jacobs, as well as a comment from Smallwood in which she claims to have contacted Jacob’s therapist and been told she was a useless cause.[00:12:31] What? F- from Smallwood. So the woman who was cheating on this lady contacted her therapist and said that the woman who the therapist was being a therapist for was a useless cause-[00:12:46] Simone Collins: Wait, wait ... and should be given up. Wait, isn’t she claiming that the therapist said that the victim of her cruelty was a worthless[00:12:51] Malcolm Collins: cause?[00:12:52] No, no, no. She’s trying to get the therapist to dump the victim of her cruelty.[00:12:55] Simone Collins: Oh.[00:12:55] As, yeah. Oh, gosh, that’s ridiculous. It’s for money. It’s not to help people. Lady, she must be too convinced that therapy culture helps anything. Ai, ai.[00:13:08] Malcolm Collins: It’s not necessarily wrong to acknowledge that infidelity in relationships can be far more complex than we have it on its surface.[00:13:14] However, the Smallwood situation demonstrates that there should be a limit. I love a, a progressive paper here being like, “Look, we all know that infidelity is fine, but, like, can we have a limit on this?”[00:13:31] Attempting to raise awareness for the complexity of some cases of infidelity is very different from outright glorifying cheaters and encouraging cheaters to be unapologetic for unnecessary and harmful actions. Mm. Is it, though?[00:13:44] Mm.[00:13:45] Additionally, as proud as Smallwood and Nicodemus claim to be about their affairs, their alleged actions suggest they’re on they’re on the contrary deeply ashamed, insecure, and unfathomably jealous.[00:13:56] They’re hardly the people who should be coaching cheating spouses if they themselves are so clearly insecure in their affair relationships. I love that they’re implying if you’re emotionally mature, that’s the type of person who should be cheating, not these types of women. By the way, just in case you’re wondering who saw it from this perspective the writer, it works for Mary Sue, but usually covers DC, Marvel, and Star Wars.[00:14:22] You wonder how those ind- those things got so bad. Hmm. You wonder how. You wonder how. So I wanted to talk about this from the meta perspective of how things like cheating get glorified and how things like divorce can act as a contagion. But before I get into that, I wanna hear your thoughts, Simone because that- that’s obviously what the audience wants to hear.[00:14:47] That’s what they’re here for.[00:14:49] Simone Collins: I’m so depressed by this. Although I, I also wish I could just wander through. I... You know how I am. Like, when I discover some new perverted thing that people do, I want to understand it so much more, and I had no idea that women were into this. It sounds to me like next level mean girling.[00:15:11] Like, high school’s over, and you’re kind of devastated that you can’t terrorize female peers anymore, and then the- they just like this, this one group of mean girls tapped in to this new channel by which they can immiserate women in their lives. Because they don’t go to, like, the same school. They’re not stuck in the same classes every day.[00:15:33] Very true.[00:15:34] Malcolm Collins: So it’s an[00:15:34] Simone Collins: interesting thing. There- there’s- And I wanna, I wanna explore it ... a lot[00:15:34] Malcolm Collins: of opportunities to terrorize other people like this-[00:15:37] Simone Collins: Yeah ...[00:15:38] Malcolm Collins: if that’s, like, your thing.[00:15:39] Simone Collins: And to, like, show how dominant you are and how much better you are, and you’re prettier, and yeah. And you can’t, yeah, you can’t put people down the same way.[00:15:47] It ju- like, our society isn’t really set up for that anymore. There aren’t, like... You know, it used to be that you were in a really tight-knit community. Like, in the, in the ‘50s, all the girls in your neighborhood might meet together for their bridge [00:16:00] club every week, and you’d go to church. And you could all, you know, you could be a mean girl there.[00:16:04] You could put her, you could put all the o- the other girls down and talk about how cheap their Sunday best was and how pathetic, you know, i- it is to- This is[00:16:11] Malcolm Collins: actually a really good point. Are things like cheating cl- everybody complains that as we’ve broken down our sense of community, that it’s removed the opportunity[00:16:21] Simone Collins: for- To bully and[00:16:22] Malcolm Collins: terrorize[00:16:22] friendships, for, you know, love, for a sense of community. But it also removed the ability for people who get turned on by, like, cheating with people and then harassing their spouses from having a community of, like, mean girls they can do that with, right? Yeah. So they’ve had to reinvent these spaces for the new world of the internet.[00:16:44] Simone Collins: And they found, they tapped into a little vein of gold here. And I, I wish I could explore it because this is fascinating. Well- I haven’t been so fascinated by something until I discovered people stuck Sharpies in a place that I never thought they would stick Sharpies.[00:16:58] Malcolm Collins: I love your, like, “But why?” But why?[00:17:02] You remind very much of the kids in South Park when they’re like, “Chef, why would a priest wanna stick up my butt?” The chef’s like, “Good day.” But that’s you. That’s you with this stuff.[00:17:13] Yes.[00:17:14] Speaker 2: Why would he put anything in your butts? We don’t know. That’s what we’re trying to figure out. Hmm.[00:17:19] Hmm. Hello there, children. Chef, why would a priest want to stick up my butt? Goodbye.[00:17:29] Malcolm Collins: But- Why do they stick them up their butt? I want to know. What’s going on? I,[00:17:35] Simone Collins: I wanted to know. I wanted to know.[00:17:37] I wanted to understand the googly eyes as well.[00:17:40] Malcolm Collins: I love also in, like, the podcast the way she talks about this stuff. So let’s go over some of her, her own framings about this. Yeah. Please. “It needs one woman to be betrayed and one woman to be the homewrecker, because if both of their loves are real, the whole framework collapses.[00:18:03] Two women loved the same man. Both knew him. Both saw something. Both stayed for reasons that made sense from the inside.”[00:18:14] Hmm.[00:18:15] Well, this is where do- for that to make sense to somebody, it, it does make sense to somebody in the urban monoculture. The, in, in the urban monoculture because, like, love is supposed to be your guide in life and the thing that determines what you do and why you do it.[00:18:29] You know, you, you’re, like, legit able to go out there and be like, “Yeah, but I loved him, so of course I cheated.” Right? Like, “What else would I do when I love somebody?” Yeah ... I have to have, have sex with them.[00:18:43] Simone Collins: Right, like- Let’s do something that potentially explodes their life and stability. Yeah.[00:18:48] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, no, I actually- Thanks a lot[00:18:49] I think a lot of this is, is, is downstream of the normalization of the LG, the, or the way that the gay movement fought for equal rights. Because that was actually the logic that they used, and that, you know, worked for a lot of people when they didn’t put a lot of thought into it, which is, well, am I supposed to go my whole life without sleeping with someone who I love and being married to them?[00:19:15] Right? Like, am I supposed to go my entire existence without being able to have sex with the people who turn me on? And when I first heard that argument as a kid, I was like, “That makes perfect-king sense. Of course. I should get the things I want,” right? And then, as I’ve said in the past, the thing that broke me out of that argument was the way that the leftists have decided to treat incels who cannot sleep with the things that they like, right?[00:19:45] Mm-hmm. And they think that that is funny and a reason to denigrate them and a sign that they are low status. And that is when I was like, “Oh, sorry, I didn’t understand. You meant hot men and women should be able to sleep with whoever they [00:20:00] want.” Well, all women and hot men. ... Not everyone, right?[00:20:04] You know, phew, ugly men, come on, not even people, right? I mean, Homac often does this in his, i- this sort of thing where he’s like, when women say that, you know, that nobody’s interested in them, and then he, like, wipes out the bottom 80% of men. But, like, actually, and he, it puts a, like, a little ghost over them, right?[00:20:24] Like, like a little, draws a little ghost. Like, “Look, no one can see them.” We’ve had him on the show before, guys. He’s a great guy. He’s[00:20:29] Simone Collins: so[00:20:29] Malcolm Collins: great,[00:20:30] Simone Collins: yeah[00:20:32] Malcolm Collins: The okay. But I think he’s got, like, a deeper point there than I think is often seen.[00:20:40] Simone Collins: Mm.[00:20:40] Malcolm Collins: Which is it’s not just women who ignore the vast majority of men who can’t get a partner, right?[00:20:47] Like, I’m not gonna say the vast majority. Let’s say 60%, right, just have very little shot. 65%. The these men... And, and note here, this isn’t just based on attractiveness, right? Like, if you get rich as a guy, it doesn’t really matter. If you’re super smart or passionate, it doesn’t really matter. Yeah. In fact, as a guy, those things are, like, dramatically bigger in fact assets to you than your looks.[00:21:08] Simone Collins: Duh, totally. Yeah.[00:21:10] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, I, I mean, this is why I always, like... It’s not that girls may not prefer it if you were slightly more buff. But as a male, there’s almost always something that you could be putting your time into, and not just one thing, but usually about 20 things you could be putting your time into that would have more impact on how attractive the gir- the type of girl you would want is to you.[00:21:33] Simone Collins: Yeah.[00:21:33] Like, Beauty and the Beast wouldn’t be a trope. A minotaur milking farm, or morning, sorry, morning glory milking farm would not be. Like, look, women aren’t naturally super hot for literal monster types, okay?[00:21:46] Malcolm Collins: Well, I mean, well, those are pretty muscular monsters. You know, could rip ‘em apart. You know, someone-[00:21:50] Simone Collins: That’s only a demonstration of their ability to have prowess in some, in some sector.[00:21:55] Yeah. Actually, I think that’s one reason why weightlifting is so big with men trying to attract women, because i- if, if you’re kind of lower stats on the height or attractiveness, you can still boost, you know, if it’s not also intelligence or wealth, if you’ve really, like, fancy muscles.[00:22:10] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, we’ve pointed out, like, anyone can gain muscle, so it’s a good- Mm-hmm[00:22:12] like, backup for a lot of guys. Yeah. Whereas a lot of guys, if they... Well, maybe this is true, and I, I should reword this. For a guy like me, if I spend time studying or working on a project, I will achieve more- Your[00:22:24] Simone Collins: payout would be big. Yeah, but if you don’t have that kind of aptitude, then it’s lost time.[00:22:29] You have to look at where you have good aptitude.[00:22:32] Malcolm Collins: True. Yeah, I guess if you’re at the bottom of the barrel of aptitude, then weightlifting probably is the best thing you can do with your time.[00:22:37] Simone Collins: Well, or maybe you have a big aptitude for weightlifting. Like, if you, if you f- if you could just do it endlessly, like you really enjoy it, then that’s- True, yeah[00:22:44] a good thing to lean into, right? You know, we, we, this, this- Or you’re doing it while you’re listening to lectures ... podcast does well because it just comes naturally to us, right? Like, it’s our fun time, and so that’s easy. So if going to the gym is someone’s fun and relaxing time, whereas, like, all the other things you could be doing to attract a mate are not, then it’s a great, smart thing to do.[00:23:02] Malcolm Collins: You make a strong point, Simone. I am-[00:23:04] Simone Collins: Well, thanks, Malcolm[00:23:07] Malcolm Collins: I am but I also think that, that the, a big mistake that guys make in these communities, and we’ve talked about this in other videos, but it’s just worth surfacing again. If you look at the studies on this, and they always brush it off. They’re like, “You see in short-term pairing, it matters a ton.[00:23:22] But with people looking for longer-term pairing, it doesn’t matter as much.” And and then they’re like, “But, you know, like, short-term’s what we want. We want casual sex.” But if you’re like, “No, I want a, I want a lifelong partner,” you can see why that looking overly buff can have the exact negative effect by attracting the type of woman who’s looking for casual sex- Yeah[00:23:43] instead of the type of woman who’s looking for somebody she’s gonna have to spend the rest of her life with.[00:23:46] Simone Collins: Absolutely.[00:23:47] Malcolm Collins: But let’s go over some of the other things she says here. “The only infidelity you can prevent is your own.”[00:23:58] The wife and the other woman are [00:24:00] not enemies. They are two women being asked the same question by the same culture, and both of their answers are being treated as evidence of poor judgment.[00:24:12] The, the, like, do you love him is the question, right? You[00:24:15] Simone Collins: know? Oh, okay. Sorry, this is difficult for me to understand.[00:24:20] Malcolm Collins: She’s trying to be poetic and flowery and, you know, I don’t understand poem stuff, so[00:24:25] Simone Collins: the, this is, this is very trying.[00:24:28] Malcolm Collins: How could she love him is it not a question. It’s a verdict dressed as a concern.[00:24:35] Simone Collins: Oh.[00:24:37] Malcolm Collins: Wow.[00:24:38] Simone Collins: Okay. God.[00:24:43] Malcolm Collins: What?[00:24:44] Simone Collins: I’m just, I, this, this woman I’m just... See, I, I’m trying to work this out though, because there is a genre of posts online too that are rage bait. And some, like there’s, there’s someone I like to follow who posts excessive cleaning routines. Like she’ll arrive at a hotel room, and she will clean the whole fricking thing.[00:25:05] Like put on new sheets on the bed, clean the toilet, clean the sink, clean the shower that kind of thing. And that, that’s rage bait. They, they do that because that’s rage bait. There’s a mother who has like 10 or 11 kids and she will just f- stock their little mini fridges full of in- insane junk food, and that’s rage bait because parents are like, “Oh, that has fructose in it.”[00:25:23] You know, like I, I, I feel like 90% of her success is not due to any legitimate action. It’s her understanding that she’s getting rage-based engagement, but that still produces a profit for her.[00:25:37] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. No, there was a a, a, a, a, a realization I had this is on, on one of the shows was Leaflet, where I had never contextualized it this way before but somebody was like, “Do you...”[00:25:50] This came from the question of do you have a crush on Leaflet? And I had never thought, because you know, if, if, if you’re thinking about somebody who you actually feel a degree of emotional closeness to I had never had it injected into my head the idea of cheating with someone I feel emotionally close to.[00:26:10] And then it immediately occurred to me, I was like, “But if I, if I attempted to do something like that with her, it would hurt her.” Right. Somebody who I presumably like.[00:26:22] Simone Collins: Yeah.[00:26:22] Malcolm Collins: Why would[00:26:23] Simone Collins: I do- So why would you do that to her? Yeah.[00:26:25] Malcolm Collins: Why would I do that to her?[00:26:27] Simone Collins: Mm-hmm.[00:26:28] Malcolm Collins: And I had never had this moment of realization before because I had never considered cheating in this context before.[00:26:34] Mm-hmm. Like actually, oh, it’s somebody who is otherwise living, you know, a good c- conservative Christian life.[00:26:41] Simone Collins: Monogamous marriage, et cetera. Yeah.[00:26:43] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, who’s searching for monogamy, who’s searching for marriage- Yeah ... and who I genuinely, deeply like as a person. Mm-hmm. Somebody’s like, “Have you thought about sleeping with him?”[00:26:55] And in my head I was immediately like, what a shitty thing that would be to do to them, not to my wife, right? Like, obviously it’s bad for my wife, but, like, it would be a complete inversion of any feeling of emotional fondness I would have towards a person, because it would be using my emotional fondness to justify hurting tha- that individual.[00:27:24] And I had never realized until I had that truly how perverse cheating is-[00:27:30] Simone Collins: Mm ...[00:27:31] Malcolm Collins: when you’re in a, a healthy society.[00:27:34] Simone Collins: Mm-hmm.[00:27:35] Malcolm Collins: Right? That hadn’t hit me before, right? Like, it’s... obviously, and this, I guess, comes to the second thing, which is, like, you can do cheating as, like, a conquest with, like, people you don’t know, which, like, may be a lower form of cheating even, because, like, at least the people you’re hurting, you don’t actually care about what happens to them.[00:27:55] But this thing where people who [00:28:00] presumably have an emotional closeness with each other-[00:28:02] Simone Collins: Well, that’s what she keeps talking about. She acts like this isn’t about the fun of hurting women. She acts like it’s actually out of care or interest in the men, so.[00:28:12] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, but she’s not talking about the guy. She’s talking about the stuff he’s buying her.[00:28:16] Simone Collins: Yeah. Yeah, ‘cause I, I think she’s gaslighting herself. A- and if not herself, then her, her clients, so. Hmm. Mm.[00:28:25] Malcolm Collins: No, I think what it is is that when she goes out there and she starts waxing all pol- ly- waxing lyrically about, “Well, I should be able to do whatever I want to do, and here’s all the things I want to do.”[00:28:38] You know? That, That she’s getting excited about, oh, what’s, what’s the way I wanna put this? A- about talking to the urban monoculture in urban monoculture language to frame what she’s doing is-[00:28:50] Simone Collins: Oh, that it’s, and it’s about love. And that’s, you know what? That’s the thing. We need to go back to transactional marriages, and it’s not like they were that old.[00:28:59] Remember the, the movie with Marilyn Monroe and some other star- stars of old Hollywood How to Marry a Millionaire, where they’re just like, “Look, my job here, I need to, like, find a wealthy man. That’s my job here.”[00:29:10] Malcolm Collins: Well, no, I mean, I think that, that it reminds me, because you see progressives do this all the time.[00:29:15] Simone Collins: Mm-hmm.[00:29:15] Malcolm Collins: And it’s a very fun form of, like, code switching. And I, I even say something that we used to do. Mm-hmm. Where, like, the trans community talking within the trans community, it’s, “This is hot, this turns me on. Like, of course, feelings of body euphoria are erotic in nature. You know, you know, I, I, I looked at myself in the mirror and jacked off today.”[00:29:39] Like, this sort of stuff you see all the time in the trans community. If you, if you go to, like, the trans subreddits and stuff like this, right? Like, it’s nor- it’s normal. And then you, you then see trans people talking to the media, you know, the, and they’re like, “I’m just born this way, you know?” Oh. “I was just, you know-” Okay[00:29:53] how can you really say that I shouldn’t be allowed to be who I am?” Mm-hmm. “And how dare you call who I am a fetish?” It’s like-[00:30:01] Simone Collins: Ah ...[00:30:02] Malcolm Collins: this flip And you can see I do it when I talk with reporters, right? Where, you know, on our show- Oh[00:30:08] Simone Collins: yeah, like with our community you’re all super reasonable, and then with reporters you’re like, “Let them all die.”[00:30:14] Malcolm Collins: No, no, no, no. I actually go in the op- I mean, in our show I, this is especially in the early days when I was talking to reporters, I’d be quite edgy about the stuff I’d say. I’d be like, like, “Come on people, like we’ve gotta talk about group differences. We’ve gotta talk about like...” And then I talk to reporters and I’m like, “You know, they’re the real racists,” right?[00:30:31] Like, how dare they say-[00:30:33] Simone Collins: Oh,[00:30:33] Malcolm Collins: I see what you mean. Yeah, yeah, yeah ... that corporal punishment makes you a monster. Don’t they know the Black community uses corporal punishments at much higher rates than the white community, and the majority of Black families use it? Are they racist? Or like, don’t they know that Latin America’s fertility rates are falling faster than the United States, and are now strictly below the United States?[00:30:56] Don’t they care about the plight of the Latin American? The poor little Mexican, he has been forgotten. Don’t they care that in Iraq and in Iran they have a lower fertility rate than the United States? We have to save that people. You know, the, the, the or when I’m talking about Israel, you know, I’ll talk about it, I’m like, Israel is just a group that had their land colonized, taking it back from the colonizers who shipped them off their land and made it unsafe to live there.[00:31:33] This is the first time any group has been able to retake their land, and now you wanna get rid of them? How can you say this about the Seminoles but not the Jews? Yeah. The Jews had an actual Holocaust, right? Like, don’t you care? Don’t you understand why they had to go there to feel safe? Meanwhile on our podcast I’m like, I really love that there’s this group that’s like super high fertility and has a lot of [00:32:00] weapons, and is not afraid to kill people who piss them off, right?[00:32:03] Like, that is awesome. I don’t f*****g care. I don’t care that their ancestors had the land. I don’t care that the Bible says they should have the land. I don’t care, none of that sh- what I care about is they are a good potential ally in the future when sh- hits the fan in terms of whatever happens next civilizational speaking, right?[00:32:23] Like, but I, I use a completely different, you know, talking point when I’m talking with like the urban monoculture, or I’m framing it for the urban monoculture because, And if people are like, “Oh, that’s so horrible. You just like the Jews ‘cause they’re a potential ally,” yeah, an ally in my goal, which is future human flourishing.[00:32:42] And future human flourishing requires people that we can work with against the barbarian forces that have achieved high fertility rates through restricting access to education, through treating women like cattle, through you know, a, an, a, a, a incredibly xenophobic views towards outsiders. If people are gonna be like, “Well, some Jews have those.”[00:33:04] It’s like, yeah, some Jews do have those, but there are much, much larger groups, right? And, and it’s typically not the Jews with the technology that have those views that would turn against us where Jews can be a useful partner because many of these groups also wanna kill Jews, which makes them natural allies, right?[00:33:21] That, that is, like, my maneuvering, right? Like a future where people aren’t suffering as much and where people have more freedom, and we get to the stars, and we take over the universe, and all that nonsense, manifest destiny, all that. But I don’t, I don’t care that the Jews are taking back colonizer land.[00:33:36] But I, I say that in the same way these women don’t actually... They don’t seem to love these men at all. That’s a very interesting... I’ve noticed you don’t do it, though. So and you don’t flip to a different mode when you talk to reporters. You use the same arguments here you use when you talk to reporters.[00:33:52] Simone Collins: Because I answer the prompt You[00:33:56] Malcolm Collins: don’t frame the prompt for your audience I don’t You’re just like, “This is what’s true.”[00:34:00] Simone Collins: You have asked me a question. I am going to answer the question. I can’t, I can’t. No.[00:34:06] Malcolm Collins: Well, I like that about you, Simone. I think our fans like that about you, you know?[00:34:10] Simone Collins: That’s sad, ‘cause I was just about to say that I think code switching gets a bad reputation.[00:34:15] It’s not a bad thing. It’s not a bad thing when people feel obligated to do it, because it is useful, and you should have the capability, which apparently I utterly lack, to be able to speak to people in terms that they can understand if you, if you have that capacity. And it’s good when people code switch it- because then they are able to speak effectively and be better understood.[00:34:37] So I wish that people viewed it positively and did it more I’m glad you do it.[00:34:45] Malcolm Collins: Yep. But I, I find this very interesting. And I wish that the guys that had... Could just see that they’re being used for money, right? Like, that’s what these women care about, right? Like, that seems to be the goal. That’s what she kept talking about.[00:35:01] Simone Collins: Do you think they would care? Because they’re getting-[00:35:04] Malcolm Collins: What they want, which is-[00:35:05] Simone Collins: Yeah ... sex. Yeah. And cheating. I mean, it’s... The only victim in this crime, as far as I’m aware, is the you know, the, the wife who’s being cheated on, whose, whose sex toys are being slimed by some derelict woman. Gross. That’s so gross.[00:35:23] I mean, I know, like, the new, the new company, which I won’t name because we’re never gonna do a sponsorship with them, I don’t know how people can manage to do that, is, like, all their toys are washable, and I guess presumably then you’re always gonna pre-wash because that’s... Who knows? Who knows who’s picked that up and...[00:35:40] Ugh, I just, mm, mm.[00:35:41] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, you don’t know, because I sleep in a different room than you, so who knows? I mean, people are always perplexed. You film in different rooms?[00:35:47] Simone Collins: Kids are always rifling through every single drawer, and they do not wash their hands after using the toilet like I tell them to all the freaking time.[00:35:57] Have you washed your ha- No. Oh, thanks for [00:36:00] reminding me. So what are you gonna get in your body if they s- rifle through a drawer? You should never expose your straws or your drinking vessels or your utensils to children because you will[00:36:12] Malcolm Collins: get sick. Yeah, who has a sex toy as, like, a married couple just, like, in their room?[00:36:16] Simone Collins: I think some couples use them, like, together.[00:36:23] Malcolm Collins: I mean, clearly this woman was using them with the guy, so[00:36:27] Simone Collins: I don’t know. The way I see it depicted in media there’s the dissatisfactory sex and then the husband falls asleep, and then the wife plays with the toy. That is what happens in the movies. It’s very consistent. This is how I understand, and presumably this is, this is how other women have been trained to contextualize these devices as well, and they just assume that that’s how it’s supposed to work.[00:36:54] But I don’t know. I don’t know. I don’t know. I don’t know.[00:36:57] Malcolm Collins: People learning that we have a far more Puritan lifestyle than they imagine, right? Like, you’re like-[00:37:02] Simone Collins: Well, I still need, I, I, we, we need to make the you know what of your you know what because that’s for posterity. It needs to be preserved. But that is really for a museum For the public record.[00:37:19] Public[00:37:19] Malcolm Collins: record.[00:37:20] Simone Collins: Yeah.[00:37:21] Malcolm Collins: Sure.[00:37:23] Simone Collins: It’s too good to go to waste. This is one of those reasons why, like, monogamy is a sh- a shame. But yeah yeah, this... Like, look, should it come as any surprise from a couple that believes that all non-procreative sex is sinful?[00:37:38] Malcolm Collins: They were like, “[00:37:40] Simone Collins: How do they, how do they do that?”[00:37:42] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.[00:37:43] Anyway, this g- this lady be crazy. I’m pretty sure 99%[00:37:47] Malcolm Collins: of[00:37:47] Simone Collins: it was RageBait,[00:37:47] Malcolm Collins: though ... the final thing I’d, I’d say on this point-[00:37:48] Simone Collins: Yeah ...[00:37:49] Malcolm Collins: which is sort of to elaborate, when people are like, “But Malcolm, why do you say you should invest in, like, projects and things that have meaning instead of, like, being as hot as possible?”[00:37:58] And being[00:37:58] Simone Collins: ripped.[00:37:59] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, and it’s like, girls are not guys. When you look at a girl, what you see is her body. Okay?[00:38:09] Simone Collins: Mm-hmm.[00:38:09] Malcolm Collins: When a woman looks at you, what she sees is- What Jack[00:38:13] Simone Collins: Donaghy sees in 30 Rock.[00:38:15] Malcolm Collins: No, not money. What she sees fundamentally is the life that she’s going to be setting up inside.[00:38:20] Simone Collins: Mm. Ah. Oh, that’s a good point, yeah.[00:38:23] What life do I have with you?[00:38:25] Malcolm Collins: The brick[00:38:26] Simone Collins: and mortar y- Is it luxurious? Am I famous? Am I pampered? Yeah.[00:38:30] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, when they say y- you’re not a woman, you can’t just drop your life and set yourself up in somebody else’s,[00:38:36] Speaker 4: , it’s not like he’s a hot girl. He can’t just bail on his life and set up shop in someone else’s.[00:38:41] Malcolm Collins: This is really a huge part of what marriage is for women and what long-term relationships are for women.[00:38:48] It’s what is my lifestyle going to be? Mm. What is my responsibilities going to be? What projects am I gonna be supporting? What, you know... And so for them y- you could think of it almost like a, well, because it’s like a quest for them, right? Like, it’s like, what’s their life quest? You, you determine that.[00:39:07] Who they marry determines that for them often. Mm. And so they’re searching for, like, the coolest life quest, and by making yourself as a life quest cooler or more meaningful or more impactful, you will secure better women of the type you wanna be dating, and you want to be dating this type of woman, the woman who’s like, “Yeah, I’m setting my life up inside of their life.[00:39:31] I’m not doing it because...” A woman who marries you because you’re hot, what, what’s gonna happen when she sees a guy who’s hotter than you? Right?[00:39:41] Simone Collins: Yeah. True.[00:39:43] Malcolm Collins: What, what’s gonna happen? But the woman who sets up, because your life is like a joint project, somebody walks along with another nascent joint project, and she’s gonna be like, “Well, you know, that would be kind of stupid,” right?[00:39:55] “Like, I’ve invested so much time in this one,” right?[00:39:57] Simone Collins: Mm-hmm.[00:39:57] Malcolm Collins: She loses the project by losing [00:40:00] the, leav- leaving the relationship.[00:40:03] Simone Collins: Absolutely[00:40:04] Malcolm Collins: I mean, I, I love those suckas like, “Wow, you know, I’m really rich already, so I can’t really build anything with them.” And it’s like, well, you can set up like a foundation to work on with them or something, you know?[00:40:13] Yeah. That’s what rich guys do. They set up found- like foundations.[00:40:17] Simone Collins: Oh gosh, you’re right. Yeah, they, they actually do[00:40:22] Malcolm Collins: For women to waste[00:40:23] Simone Collins: away their days- No, that’s such a thing ... on stupid things. No, that like, that’s a, that’s, that’s a thing for hundreds of years. Oh. Oh gosh. Okay. Yeah. And yet they still fall for it.[00:40:34] They take it really seriously. I think especially now because women think they still need to have a job and be super impressive and have a career because in qui- in perfect fairness, people will not take them seriously if they’re not doing very important serious work. Mm-hmm. And so in order to maintain- Foundation work[00:40:55] Well, they don’t frame it. These days they know how to hide it better. They’re like, “I am a, you know, like activist in this realm,” or whatever, you know? That’s sad. Oh, well.[00:41:08] Malcolm Collins: At least it’s not us, okay? Yeah. And how would you tell men, you know, as a woman who has presumably thought about cheating to protect themselves from women like yourself?[00:41:20] Simone Collins: From me?[00:41:21] Malcolm Collins: I, I’m joking, but like w- how would you advise men to protect themselves from this?[00:41:26] Simone Collins: From exploitative women?[00:41:28] Malcolm Collins: Yeah.[00:41:30] Simone Collins: Hmm. Right, because there’s this whole, a, a lot of men have, have started taking this very seriously. Because actually w- there is this, this increasing percentage of women who are triding- trying to treat dating like a, a new career hunt, because they understand that it’s incredibly hard to get a job right now.[00:41:48] So their new plan is to hitch their wagon to a husband who’s a cash cow, and her career will be married to him. And a lot of men don’t want that kind of freeloader wife. They, they don’t want that at all. And so on their first date they will ask the woman to pay, or they will instead ob- obfuscate their careers on their dating profiles.[00:42:08] Are you aware of this, Malcolm? Where they’ll be like, “I’m a carpenter.” Like, some of the examples that got exposed are super lame, ‘cause like, no you’re not. No one believes that you’re a carpen- actually, I would have totally believed that someone was a carpenter. Never[00:42:20] Malcolm Collins: mind. You are a very credulous- And you’re the type of woman they, they want, Simone.[00:42:24] Simone Collins: You know. I know. What[00:42:24] Malcolm Collins: they[00:42:25] Simone Collins: want is this dumb- I would have been like, “That’s so cool” ... sweet woman. “Tell me all about your woodworking.” No, seriously, yeah, it’s so true. And I was very insensitive to people’s careers when I, when I dated. I, I was just like, “Are you interesting?” I[00:42:38] Malcolm Collins: was hyper-sensitive.[00:42:39] Simone Collins: I know. You were hyper-sensitive.[00:42:41] I was like, “You’re a felon? Let’s go. You’re a cook? Let’s go. You’re a programmer? All right.” Like, I really didn’t care. I just wanted interesting people that were hot. Like-[00:42:50] Malcolm Collins: But this is exactly it. When you were looking for a guy, the criteria that Simone used most is- Is interesting ... are they interesting?[00:42:59] Because-[00:42:59] Simone Collins: That is so true. I dated guys shorter than me. I went on dates with guys of different races than me, so it wasn’t about, like, matched cultural, ethnic, national background. It wasn’t about matched morality, even. It, and, and these weren’t, like... Actually, some of the guys, I w- I joked that they were all hot.[00:43:14] Like, some of the guys, I would rate them as like Fives or sixes[00:43:20] Malcolm Collins: So the reason why this is important is you- Urban monoculture, hipster Simone ...[00:43:28] Simone Collins: hmm[00:43:28] Malcolm Collins: When you were thinking about the metric that you wanted to increase most about your life, if you were gonna set yourself up in somebo- man’s life-[00:43:37] Simone Collins: Mm-hmm ...[00:43:37] Malcolm Collins: was to make your own life more interesting.[00:43:40] Simone Collins: Yeah.[00:43:40] Malcolm Collins: So that is why you used interestingness as your metric for is this guy good enough.[00:43:47] Simone Collins: For sure. Yeah, yeah, especially like to, like in terms of getting in the door, that’s all you had to be as a guy for me when[00:43:54] Malcolm Collins: I was dating. And I looked for trainability. And guys today don’t look for that enough.[00:43:58] Simone Collins: I know.[00:43:59] They’re just [00:44:00] looking for Instagram models. Like th- wh- per the criteria that men that we’ve met have these days, they’re only going to end up dating OnlyFans models.[00:44:09] Malcolm Collins: Oh, of course.[00:44:10] Simone Collins: That’s it. And it’s- Well, I mean, now, now- They don’t realize, they’re like, “Well, I expect a, I want a traditional woman.” The, the[00:44:15] Malcolm Collins: queen of the new right, Asmongold’s new girlfriend, you know, really, They all are.[00:44:19] They all are ... setting the trend there. Look,[00:44:21] Simone Collins: they, I don’t know. Like, and I don’t have a problem with that. That’s also fine, but it’s, it’s kind of ironic to me because these men also typically are... I guess though, you know, in the end I think a lot of women who are on OF would prefer to be kind of just OF-ing for one guy in a monogamous relationship if he provided the lifestyle she wanted, so.[00:44:39] Yeah, I[00:44:40] Malcolm Collins: just realized if you are a right-wing female intellectual content creator- Hmm ... that’s a huge pathway of revenue you don’t have access to that all the leftists have access to.[00:44:51] Simone Collins: Oh, like the Coodermauger?[00:44:53] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, the Coodermauger is trying to clean up, pretending to be right wing and like getting, Mm-hmm[00:44:57] for people who haven’t seen this, it’s this woman who sits in very sexualized poses and says generic right-wing things.[00:45:03] Simone Collins: Yeah.[00:45:04] Malcolm Collins: Like, “We should deport illegal immigrants.” Dillon[00:45:05] Simone Collins: Omar’s horrible. Like, yeah, deport it’s so funny.[00:45:08] It’s so funny ...[00:45:08] Malcolm Collins: and she doesn’t actually have a podcast. She sets up as if she has a podcast.[00:45:12] Speaker 5: Say that men can never be women, and if we can’t say that, then we can’t live in a free society. Can we please stop addressing Ilhan Omar as a congresswoman? I mean, she’s literally a fraud. Is it true that your school, uh, your school’s libraries offer Islamic literature like the Quran and, and other things?[00:45:29] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, she[00:45:29] Simone Collins: clip farms. It looks like she like clip farmed pieces of some podcast she has, but it’s just like she’s filming her, her sound bites. And I think this is a really in- interesting and fascinating economy that once I get enough fodder on, maybe I’ll do an episode on it, of young women who are posting content that seems to, that’s designed for algorithmic traction.[00:45:50] Like the one who’s doing all the, who’s hiking the Pacific Northwest Trail in these cute little pink outfits, and she puts on her makeup every morning and her blush, and then she talks in her little girl-like voice and does her hair, and then walks 15 miles and eats an apricot ‘cause I was hungry.[00:46:05] And all these young ladies are watching these clips, and I imagine maybe some young ladies are watching like the Coodermauger’s like political commentary, not realizing that sitting in yoga pants like that is a little suggestive. And maybe they’re being culturally shaped by this person. You are[00:46:22] Malcolm Collins: the only woman i- incredulous enough to, to not notice that[00:46:29] Simone Collins: I’ve seen normal women sit like that, it just didn’t like-[00:46:34] Malcolm Collins: You see what I mean, audience?[00:46:35] You see what I mean?[00:46:36] Simone Collins: Okay, whatever. Anyway I feel like they’re shaping... I know that the hiking one, who also has an OF, is shaping, like, young lady culture, influencing a lot of young women to, like, go out and hike, which is, I think solo hiking as a young woman is, is criminally dangerous. But you and I have lift, listened to so many stories of people, like, disappearing and dying- Yeah[00:46:55] while in the, the-[00:46:56] Malcolm Collins: You know, obviously as, as Mr. Ballen fans and Lore Lodge fans, we have a- Yeah,[00:46:59] Simone Collins: if you listen to Mr. Ballen, you ain’t never going hiking, like, ever. Just, it’s, it’s a bad idea. But also you won’t live in your own house because there’s probably someone living in between the walls waiting to, waiting to kill you.[00:47:11] It’s not-[00:47:12] Malcolm Collins: By the way Lore, for the fans-[00:47:14] Simone Collins: Oh,[00:47:14] Malcolm Collins: God ... lore Lodge and us live in the same small town in Pennsylvania. I[00:47:19] Simone Collins: know. Lore Lodge, can we, like, take you out to tie me up or something? Yeah. That would be so fun.[00:47:25] Malcolm Collins: That’s a, that’s not a BDSM place, that’s a Thai restaurant, by the way. It’s a[00:47:28] Simone Collins: Thai restaurant.[00:47:29] Yeah. It’s, it’s it’s delicious. It’s fantastic. Come on.[00:47:32] Malcolm Collins: I, I, yeah, Lore’s- It’s our treat ... a cool people are like, and, and his team, ‘cause he’s got a whole team in an office in Pennsylvania Yeah,[00:47:36] Simone Collins: we will take your whole team out, dude. Like, let’s, it’d be fun. We, we like your, we like your stuff.[00:47:40] Malcolm Collins: Big fans of the channel, yeah.[00:47:41] Simone Collins: Yeah.[00:47:43] Malcolm Collins: It’s so weird to know that there’s a famous YouTuber who lives... No one ever needs to know that we met in person. I know our politics are toxic for your brand of neutrality.[00:47:52] Simone Collins: Yeah. Look, we have a lot of friends, off the record friends,[00:47:55] Malcolm Collins: who- We have a lot of off the record friends. Come on ... we[00:47:57] Simone Collins: keep secret.[00:47:58] Yeah, don’t worry. We can keep a [00:48:00] secret. Yeah.[00:48:00] Malcolm Collins: Well, and also given that he hasn’t talked about his politics, I’d be surprised if they weren’t right wing. Usually- I[00:48:08] Simone Collins: don’t know, because the, that area is, is left-leaning. I know this because- No,[00:48:12] Malcolm Collins: the area is left-leaning- ... a part of it is in, in the district I- ... but usually they can’t help but sneak in left-leaning lines into their stuff-[00:48:20] Simone Collins: Oh, that’s[00:48:20] Malcolm Collins: true[00:48:20] if they are left-leaning.[00:48:21] Simone Collins: That is[00:48:22] Malcolm Collins: true. Like, even fairly like if you watch all of their content, you, you see it. Like, a good example of this is Zero Punctuation. You know the offensive video game guy who does, like, video game critiques? Oh,[00:48:31] Simone Collins: yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.[00:48:32] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. And, like, he’s gone off about how bad Trump is before in jokes and stuff like that.[00:48:36] Oh. And you would think that he wouldn’t. There’s no reason for him to nerf his viewership. Yeah. And, like, on[00:48:39] Simone Collins: all my favorite podcasts that are, you know, they’re, they’re like, they’re girly podcasts about American folklore and historical garments. But they, they can’t help but talk about bad man, bad orange man, bad[00:48:51] Malcolm Collins: man.[00:48:51] Yeah. So if they explicitly never mention it-[00:48:54] Simone Collins: Yeah ...[00:48:55] Malcolm Collins: my thought is they’re generally- They’re,[00:48:56] Simone Collins: okay, they gotta be closeted conservatives ... generally closeted Okay.[00:48:59] Malcolm Collins: Ooh, you[00:48:59] Simone Collins: never know. Yeah.[00:49:00] Malcolm Collins: They- Yeah, yeah ... but maybe not for Townsend. I don’t know if he has poli- political opinions.[00:49:05] Simone Collins: I love him so much. He’s, he’s, he’s the real internet daddy.[00:49:09] Everyone... Like, Jordan Peterson was the fake internet daddy. Townsend is the real internet daddy.[00:49:15] Malcolm Collins: All right. Well, I love you still. You know?[00:49:16] Simone Collins: I love you too, Malcolm.[00:49:19] Malcolm Collins: Don’t, don’t go out there Cooter MOGging someone to, to get them to-[00:49:22] Simone Collins: I s- you know how much I’m, like- They are the snarlac pit to me. No, I would rather look at the snarlac pit eat pe- eat people alive than look at a cooter.[00:49:32] I swear to you. So I will never expose that part of my body ever, ever. Like, I want... Every time I have to do some kind of gynecological thing, I’m like, “I’m sorry. I’m sor-,” like, get it do- It’s, like, deeply uncomfortable.[00:49:50] Malcolm Collins: Anyway, love you to death, Simone.[00:49:52] Simone Collins: Bye.[00:49:53] Malcolm Collins: Bye. Search. I had it right here. Okay, here we go[00:49:58] Simone Collins: have... I need to sanity test y- this with you, but I have a new potential online red flag that can help, one, identify people who are going to throw you under the bus or screw you over in some way, or just not be nice to you. Mm-hmm. And that is if they have disappearing messages with you.[00:50:16] That is my theory. Ooh. If someone has set disappearing messages, they will betray you. And I say this because, this, I swear this is not a humble brag, but you and I both know that we have had and have chats, like DMs, with a very small, but, but small handful of famous people. Some-[00:50:38] Malcolm Collins: Yeah ...[00:50:39] Simone Collins: like, insane levels of, of fame, right?[00:50:43] Do they have disappearing messages?[00:50:45] Malcolm Collins: No.[00:50:46] Simone Collins: No. They probably should, but they don’t. They probably[00:50:49] Malcolm Collins: should, but they don’t.[00:50:49] Simone Collins: Like, they get the free pass. The only people I know who I have ever encountered who have disappearing messages have completely, like, thrown us under the bus or thrown me under the bus, screwed us over, et cetera.[00:51:02] Like, the only... And th- th- like it’s a, it’s a 100% thing, and that is to say, I, I, I don’t really know many people who have disappearing messages. But yeah, that’s that’s my new theory. What do you think about it? I mean, look at it this way, though. Like, if you set disappearing messages with someone, you don’t trust them.[00:51:19] You think they’re gonna screenshot you or, like, reveal things, or you wanna say things to that person that, I don’t know, y- you personally don’t feel proud of. I don’t know, but it is kind of questionable if you set disappearing messages, unless, like, you as two friends are aware that you are... Like, you both mutually agree to it.[00:51:39] Like, “Hey, let’s set disappearing messages.”[00:51:42] Malcolm Collins: Yeah,[00:51:42] Simone Collins: I, I find[00:51:42] Malcolm Collins: it- But if[00:51:43] Simone Collins: someone just sets them[00:51:43] Malcolm Collins: on you- Well, I also... The people I know who set them are typically a******s.[00:51:47] Simone Collins: Yes.[00:51:47] Malcolm Collins: Like, just from the, before they betray you or anything like that. Yes. They’re typically just people you have to deal with.[00:51:53] Simone Collins: Yeah. Yes. Yes.[00:51:56] Yes. And I, I, I came into this so innocent. I [00:52:00] was like, “Oh, I guess this is some new social convention.” But then I discovered, no, this isn’t a social convention. This isn’t a feature that most people use. And then everyone who has chosen to consistently use this feature ever since it came out- Throw me under the bus.[00:52:16] Screw me over. Anyway, I just noticed that. I- I just like thought of that today and I was like- Yeah ... oh my God.[00:52:22] Malcolm Collins: No, it’s a, it’s a good pattern recognition from what I’ve seen. People can shout out in the comments. Yeah, red flag. I think there’s a person who’s gonna feel the need to write in to justify themselves.[00:52:31] Yeah.[00:52:31] Simone Collins: But it, this is my like Liz Lemon, “It’s a deal breaker.” Disappearing messages, that’s a deal breaker, ladies. So- All right ... I’m ready.[00:52:39] Malcolm Collins: So I’ll get started here.[00:52:41] Speaker 8: So you have a military base and Titan. What is this? Cathedral A giant beauty. What kind of beauty is it? What does it do?[00:52:56] Yeah? A castle. A castle? It’s a T-Rex. It’s a T-Rex, Indy? Where? Yeah. It’s right there. Yeah? It’s on all the books. Toasty, thank you so much. I really appreciate it. High five, buddy. Look. Oh, okay. This is a public episode. 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