] Malcolm Collins: Hello, Simone. I am excited to be here with you today. Today we are gonna be talking about something that is crazy that it happened, and it shifts a likely permanent shift in American politics going forwards. So at the CDA, which is the official collegiate youth outreach arm of the Democratic National Convention, and this was their major convention this year, okay?[00:00:22] Mm-hmm. Huh.[00:00:24] An event happened.[00:00:26] Speaker: Hasan delivers a Hitler style rant in a Mao Zedong suit. Oh my God.[00:00:30] Speaker 3: Diese Leute und Hassbewegungen, welche unser Leben zu beherrschen trachten, fürchten am meisten die volkstümliche Aktion der Demokratie des Volkes. Sie fürchten uns aus dem einfachen Grunde, dass es mehr von uns gibt als von ihnen[00:00:46] Malcolm Collins: Now, if you are somebody who watches American politics, you are probably familiar with the left, that there are a number of factions. And if we were going to say what are the two dominant factions right now one I’ll call the Hasan faction.[00:01:05] Simone Collins: Okay.[00:01:06] Malcolm Collins: The Hasan faction is primarily concerned about Islamist politics, the destruction of Western institutions, and doesn’t really care about things like cash redistribution or anything like that, right?[00:01:18] Apparently now he streams with in the background a framed news clipping of the day after 9/11, which he has called out as, as doing himself. This is how extreme he is on wanting America and the West to fall. Like that’s his core ideology[00:01:35] Malcolm Collins: Like, theythey’ll talk about that if they think they can get something out of it, but the core goal is the destruction of Israel and America, you know? Death to Israel, death to America. That’s, that’s sort of their thing.[00:01:45] Hmm.[00:01:45] And like, Hasan said, like, I- America deserved 9/11, you know. He said that Hamas is really cool.[00:01:52] Their, their flags are cool. Like, the, I think it was like the Houthi flags are really cool and, like, the... You know, he- he just, generally glazed and said that a pirate who liked killing civilians was like Luffy. Yeah,[00:02:04] Simone Collins: no, well, ‘cause yeah ... was the most- He was like, “This is gonna be crazy, but have you heard of One Piece?”[00:02:08] And then the translator explains it to them, and the guy’s like, “Oh yeah, of course.” It’s a cute conversation, honestly.[00:02:14] Malcolm Collins: It’s a cute conversation. But, but it- It’s very cute ... it- it shows the world that Hasan wants.[00:02:19] Simone Collins: Yeah, sure. He[00:02:19] Malcolm Collins: wants America to, to fall. Like, that basically the gist- Oh,[00:02:23] Simone Collins: yeah ...[00:02:23] Malcolm Collins: and this is the huge part, or become Islamist.[00:02:26] And this is a huge part of what a portion of the left increasingly wants. This is where- Mm-hmm ... the Zohreh Mondani faction comes in. This is where they’re much less concerned with what we would consider traditional leftist ideas.[00:02:40] Hmm.[00:02:40] The other faction of the left is the, we’ll call them, I think there’s a good sort of archetype of it, the destiny faction.[00:02:49] Destiny, if, if you look at the scandals that he has, it’s things like letting his wife sleep with other men, like into polyamory, and then she ends up leaving him and th- and be sad about that, and that’s some big scandal. Or, like, you know, weird you know, leaks around, oh, is, is he doing this gay thing or whatever, right?[00:03:12] The type of stuff that y- one, you know, Hasan, I would not expect a leak that turns out Hasan is, like, secretly gay or letting his girlfriend, who he does secretly have, sleep with other people. By the way, I don’t know if you’ve seen- He has[00:03:24] Simone Collins: a secret girlfriend?[00:03:25] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, he has. It’s, it’s pretty well known he has a secret girlfriend, yeah.[00:03:28] Simone Collins: Oh, I guess he can’t be open about it because there’s all these women who wish that he would cheat on Mikaya. Well,[00:03:31] Malcolm Collins: she’s also an influencer.[00:03:33] Simone Collins: Oh, okay, yeah, so she probably can’t also let it be known that she’s unavailable. Okay.[00:03:38] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, yeah. But she has talked about how she never wants kids and everything like that publicly, so you know, his bloodline ends with him.[00:03:44] Man. And he’s been pretty upset recently seeing Asmongold get a public and very cute girlfriend. I don’t know if you’ve seen Asmongold’s girlfriend.[00:03:51] Simone Collins: No. Who is it?[00:03:54] Malcolm Collins: Just look her up. Oh, that’s cute. She’s been trolling people a lot. Y- just, just Google- Oh ... Asmongold’s girlfriend.[00:03:58] Simone Collins: Okay.[00:03:58] Malcolm Collins: But yeah well, well, I [00:04:00] mean, I hope.[00:04:00] They haven’t confirmed that they’re dating yet, but it seems pretty obvious she’s sleeping at his house.[00:04:04] Simone Collins: Aw. Aw.[00:04:07] Malcolm Collins: Right? Very cute. I, I, I will say Asmongold seems to have a type. But-[00:04:11] Simone Collins: Well, I don’t, she does kind of not look human I, I don’t wanna say it, but she looks like a sex doll. Am, am I wrong?[00:04:22] Malcolm Collins: I, I can see where you’re getting that, but I think that, Simone, that’s just what Asian people look like when they’re super old.[00:04:28] No,[00:04:28] Simone Collins: Yeah, I guess ‘cause, you know, she looks like those, you know those the, the, the AI robots- Mm-hmm ...[00:04:32] that came from C3 world in China that were just announced in July. Like, I, I, I, she looks like she walked out of that lineup.[00:04:41] Malcolm Collins: She kind of does. I’ll, I’ll give you[00:04:43] Simone Collins: that. Then[00:04:43] Malcolm Collins: come on. She completely does.[00:04:44] But that’s not really an insult. She’s just saying that she looks like[00:04:46] Simone Collins: the way you would design a human. No, she’s, she looks optimized. Yeah. Yeah. In the same way that, like, if Kim Kardashian put on an Instagram filter, it would change nothing because the filter has been, like, trained on her face that she is...[00:04:56] It is, it is good for her. Okay. Yeah. I, now I see a picture of her without as much makeup and she looks-[00:05:01] Malcolm Collins: So[00:05:01] Simone Collins: if we’re- No, she still looks like a sex doll. This is disturbing. Okay, I can’t look at it. I... Man, I was happy and now I’m scared.[00:05:06] Malcolm Collins: If we’re, if we’re back to the, the, the two factions of the Democrats, okay?[00:05:09] Okay.[00:05:10] Simone Collins: Yes.[00:05:10] Malcolm Collins: So, Destiny, if we think about what does Destiny stand for in terms of, like, values and things he fights for? It’s, like, pro-trans stuff, pro-gay stuff, pro-polyamory stuff pro actual social wealth redistribution, trying to help workers and actually pragmatically attempting to win elections.[00:05:31] Simone Collins: Well, it seems like what you’re trying to say is that he is actually fighting for the things that they say they’re fighting for and Hasan is fighting for the downfall of the United States and-[00:05:40] Malcolm Collins: Well, he’s fighting for the things they said they were fighting for a while ago. Okay. Hasan is, is just more, like, he’s, he’s not actually...[00:05:48] He doesn’t have some, like... When he talks about, like, the social programs he wants to see in the United States, he’d be like, “I want it to look like China,” where everyone knows China has a third the social programs the United States has. Even when you adjust for the, the ver- the value of the various currencies China is dramatically less socialist than the United States.[00:06:06] But a- and if you talked to, you know, De- Destiny wouldn’t want America to be like China. He’d immediately be like, “But, like, being gay is banned in China.”[00:06:15] Simone Collins: Yeah.[00:06:15] Malcolm Collins: And like, you know, like, it, a- also, like, they’re just not as socially generous. They just, like, let people... Like, what are you talking about, right?[00:06:21] Like, he would, he would not want that. Hasan so wants it that that he actually went, like, when he’s, like, the things that I want, it isn’t wealth redistribution, it’s authoritarianism. I mean, he’s pretty, he’s pretty open about this, right? Like, that’s- Mm ... how China’s different than the United States. He even went to the event, this, this big, you know, college event, dressed up as Mao.[00:06:45] Simone Collins: Like, intentionally or just in the style of?[00:06:47] Malcolm Collins: Oh, intentionally. Like he did, he, he said he wouldn’t criticize Mao Cosplaying as- A guy who killed, like... Did, do you know that Mao depending on the numbers you’re using, like you can use slightly different numbers to, to get this different ways, killed more innocent people during the five years of the Great Leap Forward than died over the entire course of the American slave trade?[00:07:09] Yeah. You, you, you you wanna talk about scale of evil here that Hasan is LARPing. Mm. But anyway. So, Hasan apparently instructed the event, the official DNC central event for youth and youth outreach and college outreach, to ban Destiny and Destiny’s friends, like, you know, the whiter people who know Destiny- Mm-hmm[00:07:36] , From going into the convention.[00:07:39] Speaker 5: You know, I literally, I literally, I literally told him that and he said like, “Nah, nah, don’t pay attention to yourself.” I literally told him that. We should’ve been like, we should’ve been more Palestine signed up, honestly. Going to look for Santa on road trips. Park. Back of the bedroom, why? I talked to the guy- Why NC?[00:07:54] NC ... he was giving me a press, the same guy that was kicking you out, he was giving me a press pass. The Vi- the VP guy? Yes, yes. He said we couldn’t find any press pass, but he said like- He should’ve been like, “Bro, [00:08:00] I stan for Gaza[00:08:00] Simone Collins: Why? Why? Like there must’ve been some reason. Like he said something- Well- ... he’s being canceled right now ...[00:08:05] Malcolm Collins: what they said is that they were afraid that Destiny would cause a commotion of some sort, right? Like-[00:08:11] Simone Collins: Commotion. A commotion? ...[00:08:12] Malcolm Collins: disagree with Hasan publicly. Who knows?[00:08:15] The problem is, is that there are literally no public records that Destiny or anyone in his group has ever once yelled over speakers at a Democrat event protesting disruptively at a Democrat event, or getting removed from a Democrat Republican Party event. Which makes perfect sense. I- he represents the more status quo position for what the Democrats attempt to represent of themselves.[00:08:49] Hasan represents the new direction, which is just destroy the r- the, the Jews, destroy the West, destroy Israel, destroy America. I don’t really care what comes next as long as it’s more Islamist or gives Islamist power more power Destiny not being allowed in for this reason is actually wild. And it’s more wild because his supporters who are trying to get in with him, who obviously represent, you can call it the more moderate view, but I wouldn’t even say it’s the moderate view.[00:09:24] It’s just a completely... Like, the two parties want nothing the same. One party wants gay people thrown off of roofs. One party... Well, I mean, that’s obviously the end state or goal of the practical policies that Hasan is pushing. One per- people... They’re, I mean, obviously that’s why Hasan doesn’t care about China’s gay policies, because he doesn’t actually care about gay people.[00:09:46] That’s not part of his agenda. The other one wants, you know, gay people getting married, and trans marches and everything like that, right? Like, the, these two things aren’t, like, two different but compatible visions for where the Democratic Party could go. They are completely incompatible. And everyone knows this, but they’ve sort of gotten around it by just not not clashing on these issues.[00:10:07] So why did Hasan ban him? And keep in mind, this is also weird, because it, it’s clear from all the records we have that Hasan banned him, okay? I, I, I need to be very clear about this. Hasan told the organizers, “You need to ban him and everyone there who’s, who’s affil- affiliated with him.” Now, note, a lot of the people affiliated with him are...[00:10:27] Sorry, everyone affiliated with him and him had bought, paid for entrance to go into this conference. Oh, so,[00:10:34] Simone Collins: you didn’t just, like, block their registration. This was a serious, like, “We’re, we’re gonna... You’ve paid and we’re gonna deny you.” He... But couldn’t he have just called the conference organizers and said, “Hey,” ahead of time, “Can you just cancel his ticket and refund him, and tell him to cancel his flight and...”[00:10:50] Malcolm Collins: No. I, I think the reason was is because he didn’t know that Destiny would be there, and he heard during the conference from somebody that Destiny was coming. Oh. And that’s when he decided to do this. Like, essentially, it seems like what happened is Hasan got super threatened when he heard that Destiny was coming.[00:11:09] Simone Collins: Hmm.[00:11:10] Malcolm Collins: Why he felt threatened, I mean-[00:11:12] Simone Collins: Yeah, they fill such different segments of the space, as far as I’m aware. It doesn’t make sense to me. I feel like there must be something going on that we don’t know about. Right?[00:11:24] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, I’m, I’m checking here if they have some sort of a current conflict. This would be like, for people who are unaware of the politics in Destiny this would be like if, Charlie Kirk getting banned from an event because a RNC event because Nick Fuentes was afraid that he would make fun of him.[00:11:40] Speaker 7: And if you’re offended by this comparison, you know as well as I do that if there was a Charlie Kirk on the left, he would be a weirdo sex pest in a polyamorous relationship.[00:11:49] That’s what a mainstream, , leftist middle ground person would be[00:11:55] Malcolm Collins: Right? Like, they represent, like, th- this is, this is actually [00:12:00] complete insanity that this is happening. Or, or b- or better, A- Asmongold. Asmongold probably represents something closer. Asmongold getting banned from an event because Nick Fuentes was afraid that Asmongold would attack him. Mm.[00:12:11] Which doesn’t even make sense if you know, like, Asmongold’s personality. He, he would be very unlikely to do that. But it’s more just, like, a shallow ego thing on the part of Hasan. I’m asking if they’re part of an ongoing dispute, and it’s like yes, they do have a dispute. It’s one of the more persistent, better documented political, in political streaming.[00:12:31] It’s primarily ideological. But it’s also, they personally criticize each other on streams. So yeah, it appears that Hasan was just scared that somebody could call him out, I guess, at the event. But what’s weird about this is the event organizers being... And note, the event let in a known terrorist, right?[00:12:53] Like, th- this is the other thing about this. Somebody who had been convicted for making terrorist threats. A, a guy named Jared Mackey he was convicted on calling up 11 accounts of making a terrorist threat, a class 10 felony. This was in 2025, so recently w- as well. On Taco Bell, McDonald’s, Sonic- But-[00:13:14] Domino’s.[00:13:15] Simone Collins: Wh- why? Lounge.[00:13:17] Malcolm Collins: Now this appears less bad, which could be why he was let in. It does not appear aft- out of some Islamist goal. It appears that he was just being a dick.[00:13:27] Simone Collins: Okay. Yeah.[00:13:28] Malcolm Collins: His predominant goal was some, like, just a prank, bro. Something like that, right?[00:13:35] Simone Collins: Okay.[00:13:35] Malcolm Collins: But he said that, like, people were gonna get their heads shot off and stuff like this.[00:13:39] Like, very graphic, Oh. But he’s allowed in the convention, but not Destiny and Destiny’s major supporters. So, what this represents to me is a definitive win, and it matters a lot that this happened at the youth conference. ‘Cause this is like, what’s the next stage of the Democratic Party and Democratic ideology?[00:14:00] Who captures the next stage? The, the official youth of the DNC, right? Yeah. So if, if, if the mainstream of the DNC is captured by bad actors, how captured is the youth? And note, Nux has talked about how Nux is, is, he’s done a good job getting Hasan a lot of the institutional people from the DNC from pulling away from Hasan.[00:14:22] That- And even like CNN criticizing him. That does not seem to be the case with the younger leaders. Mm. They seem to be so afraid of criticizing Hasan that they would worse putting themselves on the outs with Destiny. And note here Destiny by the way, despite being the more bland one, was banned from Twitch when he had almost a million subscribers.[00:14:48] And given that Twitch constantly simps for Hasan this is... Actually, why was Destiny banned?[00:14:54] Despite Hasan constantly doing stuff that should get him banned.[00:14:57] Simone Collins: Yeah. Well, the thing is, I don’t hear about Destiny Like, i- if you had told me at the beginning of this that Destiny is no longer relevant and is, like, retired as of last year, I’d be like, “Oh, yeah, that makes sense. I have no idea.”[00:15:09] Malcolm Collins: No, Destiny’s probably the biggest mainstream leftist podcaster[00:15:13] Simone Collins: That’s strange.[00:15:14] Yeah, I guess I- Who I’m aware of. ... I don’t see clips of him. I don’t see people referencing him. He- I don’t see him making guest[00:15:18] Malcolm Collins: appearances ... he’s about half the size of Hasan that, that, that said which again shows the faction of the left that actually is gaining power.[00:15:27] Simone Collins: Hmm.[00:15:27] Malcolm Collins: They banned him for quote-unquote “hateful content.”[00:15:31] Given that they’ve left Hasan up, I think it also shows how much the institutional class of the left is captured by the Hasan version of Democrat because, yeah, they’ve banned, right, you know, put bans on Asmongold, Nucks, stuff like this. But they’ve never put a serious longterm ban on Hasan despite demonstrably doing significantly worse stuff than any of the other creators, which can only show they just ideologically align with this anti-Western Islamist [00:16:00] form of Democratic future-ism.[00:16:02] And we talked about this in another episode where we were, like, trying to determine the future of the Democratic Party, and I was like, “They keep dropping their classic issues.” They dropped e- environmentalism, like even Greta Thunberg. But now she’s, like, anti-colonialist, which again would go with the Islamist faction on boats filled with, you know, the anti-Israel Muslim whatever blockade, the Gaza blockade.[00:16:23] So she’s, you know, seeing where the wind is, is, is going and it’s[00:16:26] Simone Collins: in that direction. Well, but she would insist to you that colonization is upstream of environmental degradation, so what[00:16:34] Malcolm Collins: she’s really doing- No, no, no, no, that- that- it’s the opposite.[00:16:36] Simone Collins: Really?[00:16:37] Malcolm Collins: Well, upstream, oh, yeah, no, downstream.[00:16:39] Simone Collins: No, it’s upstream of it, as in colonialism causes it per her assertion.[00:16:43] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, that’s downstream.[00:16:45] Simone Collins: No, upstream. If something is the cause, it is upstream of the thing. If I poop upstream of you, do you want to be downstream? Yes. Or[00:16:51] Malcolm Collins: do you want to be upstream? So, so relative to each other, the colonialism is upstream of environmental- Yes ... degradation because it’s the opposite.[00:16:58] That’s[00:16:59] Simone Collins: what I’m saying. Yes, that’s what I’m saying. Colonialism is upstream. Then you said. And that is why Greta is going for it.[00:17:06] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, so, well, that’s how she’s justified her, her switch. But I mean, I guess you can see this in the numbers as well, but I was like, okay, so they don’t care about the environment anymore.[00:17:15] They don’t seem to care about, like, Black people particularly anymore. Like, that, that, that was largely given up. They don’t really seem to be that anti-Nazi anymore. They’re, like, literally running a Nazi, right? They don’t seem to care about... This is the main guy, by the way, with the SS tattoos. Ugh,[00:17:30] Simone Collins: forgot about him.[00:17:31] Malcolm Collins: You for- you forgot about that? Yeah. Yeah. It’s a joke. I didn’t f- I didn’t know what that was.[00:17:38] Simone Collins: He had no idea. Look, this happens in Asia all the time. People are, like, buying, you know, costume uniforms. They don’t realize that they’re dressing like- Nazi officers, so yeah[00:17:48] Malcolm Collins: I don’t know. He hates the Jews a lot.[00:17:49] I think it fits in line with some of his other statements. No, so we got, we got but I was saying like, they don’t care about that anymore. They don’t like, Me Too is, and stuff like that. Like, okay, somebody said that Biden graped them. Like, does, did any leftist care? No, nobody cared about that anymore.[00:18:03] Simone Collins: Did someone say that?[00:18:04] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, yeah, yeah. We talked about it in another episode. I thought[00:18:06] Simone Collins: people said he was creepy.[00:18:09] Malcolm Collins: I don’t think that episode went live. We’re filming too many episodes. But yeah, there was an episode where, yeah, yeah, where somebody accused him. Remember they were like, he said something like super Biden-y.[00:18:19] Like, “Hey man, I thought you were into me.”[00:18:22] Simone Collins: This sounds like a complete hallucination. I, or you know what? I need to get more sleep. I’m probably just forgetting everything. You know I forget everything anyway. Yeah.[00:18:29] Malcolm Collins: But yeah, so big, big scandal there. Nobody cared. But yo, as, as you’re showing, nobody cared.[00:18:32] Nobody cared about that anymore. Nobody cares about that stuff anymore, right? Like, it’s, it’s not a, a viable on the left anymore. I mean, especially, you know, you’re dealing with all the grapes in, in October 11th and everything like that. Yeah. It’s, it’s way harder to be like, especially when you’re, you’re defending countries with like crazy essay rates.[00:18:49] Like, that Egyptian had an essay rate of 99% in one official survey, right? Like, a lot of these countries just have crazy high essay rates. And so you can’t be like, “Oh, it’s, this is, so it’s like this is just normal in these countries,” whatever. So, or it was immigrants. You know, you bring over immigrants, and now they’re, they’re graping everyone in the grape gangs and stuff like that, right?[00:19:08] And you wanna cover that up. It’s harder to be like, “Oh, well, a grape’s a major problem.” Like, remember when the left was like all freaked out about grapes, and then and Obama did all these things to like lower the, the grapes in colleges and everything like that, and then they just like stopped talking about it?[00:19:22] Like... Well, they stopped talking about it because it collides with the group that is beginning to gain dominance within their party. Oh, dear. And then you look at the major streamers or the people in the party. You know, like, like, Mondami, like Hasan. A lot of them are explicitly from these groups historically, right?[00:19:40] And like have these, you know, historic blood feuds within this particular region. And I think they, like I, I, I personally am just astonished that this happened. When I heard that this happened, I was genuinely... I thought Nux had done a good job of playing the game, shutting down Hasan, being normalized, [00:20:00] being mainstreamed, and yet we’ve seen capture at this point.[00:20:04] Like, that’s, that’s the clamp. That’s, that’s closed, right? Like, you, you hold out destiny for Hasan? That, that is, there, there’s almost no one I can think of more emblematic for a left-wing thinker on the, let, let’s say like gay western side. Like whatever[00:20:24] Simone Collins: Pride culture is I feel like something else has to be going on though, because even like just from a content perspective, it’s better for there to be a conflict in public that creates views, controversy, follow-on commentary, right?[00:20:35] Like the entire economy benefits from there being in-person conflict, assuming that you’re not going to be killed. So I just don’t understand why he would not welcome that. I feel like maybe there wasn’t going to be any, and perhaps it could be that the reason he did this was because that was the conflict.[00:20:57] Him banning him in this way was the conflict. I don’t know, but-[00:21:00] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. I, I mean, if you wanna talk about like what he did when he was on stage, like you can be like, “Well, maybe he like censored himself for this environment.”[00:21:07][00:21:07] Speaker: Hasan delivers a Hitler style rant in a Mao Zedong suit. Oh my God.[00:21:12] Speaker 2: No more to the Democrats who compromise, who conciliate, and who betray us. No more to the Democrats who will collaborate and cooperate with the fascists. We don’t need those Democrats anymore. In fact, I-[00:21:26] Malcolm Collins: Anyway just absolutely crazy that this happened. I I, I know that he specifically attacked them for being too moderate and they need to go to his version of extremism.[00:21:34] But I said when I was like, “Okay, well, it’s not the environment anymore. It’s not gays anymore. It’s not trans people anymore,” ‘cause like that’s completely in retrograde. It’s not, What other things? Yeah, it’s, it’s, it’s not women, it’s not Black people, certainly not Hispanics now that they, they know that they vote for Trump.[00:21:51] You know, Their faction has won of this particular power struggle it looks like. And so who knows what would prevent or retard this victory. But for now, that feels pretty locked in to me. And we’ll see if we get more candidates coming out like this. But yeah, this is the, the Islamist faction winning that particular power battle.[00:22:13] Simone Collins: Well look, we, we keep talking on the right about, like, “Oh, look at all the amazing things that done, get done when you have an autocracy.” Maybe this is just more of that.[00:22:23] Malcolm Collins: Well, I mean, the, the DNC has always been an autocracy. It’s like what do the people at the top want?[00:22:26] Simone Collins: Right, but now aesthetically they’re going for it, instead of having the performative we’re of the people thing.[00:22:32] Yeah. Maybe it’s just across the aisle, autocratic style behavior is trending. I could see that happening. That could make sense.[00:22:40] Malcolm Collins: Well, this is I mean, I guess where, where are we on the right right now? I mean, in the right there’s really two competing factions that are ideologically alive. There’s obviously GOP Inc.,[00:22:51] which is, like, mostly dead. Was, like, the weird red pill, older red pill orbiter type people that don’t, didn’t really change over time and just keep, you know, i- I think sort of, like, attempting to look manly, like Andrew Tate and stuff like that. But they don’t have, they’re not, like, a real representative of, like, a real growing youth movement or anything like that or, or ideological movement.[00:23:11] Really the core ideological fight in the right right now is our faction like the nerd right. And the or the new right or the tech right, whatever you wanna call it, nerds. I think nerd right’s probably the, the most accurate. Versus the gripers. And th- the, the largely speaking, and we’ve pointed this out, I mean, the gripers seem to have lost.[00:23:33] There was a short period where it looked like they were gonna gain power again. And then I, I think that their ability to gain power kind of slipped for two reasons. I think griperism looked really cool when people didn’t know a lot about- A American Catholic history or and then when people learned about that, they’re like, “Oh, this isn’t really based in American.[00:23:57] This is, like, some weird [00:24:00] other thing,” or, or what the Vatican was up to or... Like, a lot of that stuff, I don’t think any of that would’ve come up, any of our talk of that stuff, I wouldn’t have seen it as relevant if the core opposing faction on the right didn’t have this griper identity. But, you know, if, if you can under- undermine the sort of Vatican first mindset of that, then you can undermine a lot of, of the griper id- or, w- like, wanting that.[00:24:23] So I think that that was one thing that ended up pushing them back a lot, and the other was you know, because Nick was unable to get a purchase in the mainstream right, he ended up just saying, “I’m a Democrat now” and going Democrat, right? Like, right, he... And he, and we’ve said actually his faction aligns probably more with the faction that’s winning in the Democrats right now, like the eradicate the Jews faction than it aligns with, with, th- the, the, the right or any of the factions on the right anymore.[00:24:52] Mm-hmm.[00:24:52] And to really put a pin in this, his upcoming big interview is with Hunter Biden where they, you know, get along really well. , He really does seem to be aligning himself, I know a lot of people are a bit surprised by this, but, but with the left[00:25:04] Malcolm Collins: And in terms of the nerd right, how much have they won in terms of institutional power? I mean, they basically staff the entire White House right now. They are... The, if you look at the types of memes that the White House is posting they’re clearly nerd right memes, clearly downstream of 4chan culture, not like this old boomer nonsense.[00:25:23] And if you look at the, the main candidates, like, the VP is literally JD Vance, right? Like, you don’t get more... I mean, have you seen the pictures of him as a kid? Mm-hmm, mm-hmm ... but also coming out of, out of Tealverse, Tealverse has always been sort of the the architect of the institutional branch of the nerd right gaining and, and, and holding power.[00:25:42] So I mean, that’s, that’s been, And even the other figures who you would think, like, who’s, who’s the guy after JD Vance w- who everyone is focused on, it’s, like, Rubio. Rubio does not represent alt-right ideology. Like, you know, Cuban guy? Come on, right? Like, this is very, like- Hmm. I[00:25:59] Simone Collins: guess he’s not like that old ‘90s Christian conservative[00:26:04] Malcolm Collins: Well, yeah, I mean, that’s not the, the, the, I mean, the first part of his identity is the creating an American empire really.[00:26:12] Simone Collins: I[00:26:12] Malcolm Collins: guess so, huh? ... that appears to be his goal. We’re creating a bunch of American, I mean, th- that’s what you want somebody from, like, Cuba and is like, “I want to turn Cuba into, like, an American vassal state,” right? Like, “Then, then my people will be safe when all the world is an American vassal state,” or every strategic node.[00:26:29] And that also aligns with the, the, i- ironically, the nerd-right faction a lot more than the gripers. I mean, a- actually, if you’re putting JD Vance and Marco Rubio in a line next to each other, Marc- Marco Rubio is more, because the nerd right i- is, is pretty famously hawkish in terms of, like, at least no feet on the battle, the, the ground.[00:26:49] Just, you know, do attack our enemies, do deal with the bad guys. Mm-hmm. Mm. Which puts us much closer to the, the Rubio camp, even than JD, who would be seen as, as very far. So I just think that there’s, like... They’ve got no purchase. They’ve got, they, they, the other faction right now is just completely in the wilderness while ours continues to consolidate and grow.[00:27:09] Which has been really fun to see because one of the big changes over the past few months has been, like, way more collabs among the nerd-right participants.[00:27:19] Simone Collins: It’s been nice to see. Yeah.[00:27:21] Malcolm Collins: Mm-hmm. Oh, and if we have mods for any other, like, big figures in the nerd right, who want us to do collabs let us know.[00:27:28] I recently sent an email to Powder and to, Gosh, who was the other one I sent an email to?[00:27:33] Simone Collins: Oh, Rev, didn’t you?[00:27:34] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, Powder and Rev. Yeah, it’s like, “Yeah, come on.” Like, they’d be cool to have on. I’m trying to get Rev and Straub on at the same time. I think it’d be fun to do, like, a husband-wife collab stream.[00:27:45] Simone Collins: It would be so fun. Yeah.[00:27:46] Malcolm Collins: It would be fun. I don’t think anyone’s s- you know, the joint interview with him would be a lot of fun. But yeah, the it’s, it’s, it’s just been fascinating to, to see the left having a battle, our side having a battle, and where things are, are, are [00:28:00] shaking out. What, what does mean in terms of the shakeout is it becomes increasingly existential that we win the left versus right battle, right?[00:28:09] Because if the faction that controls the left now just wants the destruction of Western society and, like, the subjugation of white men th- which is, is one of the, you know, their core goals often a, whatever you try to point out, “Oh, look at this discrimination. Look at this c- covering up crimes.”[00:28:23] We, we’ve talked about this. We, we have to like one, very cool that we appear to be winning here. But we’ve gotta continue, continue to fight, you know, continue to move forwards. Absolutely. And one of the things I’d suggest for fans of this show is if you are thinking about what you wanna do for your future you know, getting into politics is not the worst thing you can do in terms of political campaigns, political administrations, political events like the, you know, the RNC conventions and stuff like this.[00:28:50] Especially because these platforms have been disproportionately, that is the one area where the gripers are beating us, is infected with gripers. And it’s mostly because the gripers, being Catholics are way more bureaucratic and institutionally specialized. The Catholics have always been, like, super, super largely out, out represented within any bureaucracy.[00:29:12] And so they’ve been able to worm their way into a lot of these big think tanks where you know, I think, I, I wish that we had more of our ideological voice pushing back. Now fortunately, they haven’t made it into the administration. Like, everyone we’ve talked with in the administration is super our faction, but you, you wait, you let the rot grow, and eventually it works its way into things.[00:29:32] Hmm.[00:29:32] and note here when I’m talking about the Catholic thing, I’m, I’m talking about, like, the specific form of griper Catholicism. Like, obviously if I see JD Vance as being one of the heads of this movement, who is a, a Catholic, right? Like, I’m not, like, anti all Catholics or something. I’m just, like, the, the griper identity, a, a portion of the political identity of griperism is anti-Jewish, pro-Catholic.[00:29:57] That’s part of the identity. And the... I mean, you can see our video where we talk about that. That just doesn’t really work with America’s history or whatever it historically meant to be an American, which is I think is why they have so many un-American ideas. Because it, it, it’s just an idea that, like, for the same reasons that they have weird ideas that the Founding Fathers didn’t want represented in American politics.[00:30:22] Simone Collins: Do you think these people actually... Like, do these factions matter? Because they... N- not a single name you mentioned was leading any sort of lobbying organization or a think tank or a major donor, more importantly, a political action committee or m- m- a, a politician.[00:30:42] Malcolm Collins: So this is, this is really, this is really an important point that you just made right here.[00:30:45] Do these factions matter? So this nerd right versus griper fight that the right has been having, and I guess you could say before that the fight that both of us had against the legacy right, did it in any way change national politics? Oh, yeah, the entire staffing of the current White House, the vice presidential candidate, both of the next pr- proverbial presidential elect candidates national politics and policy, because they’ve largely done nerd right things in terms of their policy, not, not old right things.[00:31:17] They haven’t done any of the Heritage Foundation stuff. They have, Look at the Twitter feed. Look at the signaling. Look at... All of it, this coming out of the White House, looks very, very, very nerd right coded. Mm. You can be like, did the fight, the online culture war that we had, did it end up impacting anything that’s actually happening in politics?[00:31:35] I’d be like Yeah, like the whole effing thing. Like the whole, the whole bag, the whole victory is downstream of this. Even if these fights that we have online seem very esoteric or the numbers seem like, oh, it’s 10,000 there, 20,000, 30,000 there the downstream effects,[00:31:54] For more confirmation of this shift within the Democratic Party and how mainstream it’s gone, Democratic congressional [00:32:00] candidate Melissa Chaudhry removed LGBTQ+ rights as an issue that she would vote for because she was afraid it would offend Muslims[00:32:09][00:32:09] Also, heads up, , just, , I think it was a couple days ago, yesterday maybe, , somebody ran into a Pride event, , with a car, running over a bunch of people, and of course, as it turned out, it was a Muslim immigrant. And, , leftists are already writing cover for them, so that’s fantastic[00:32:25] And again, if you think that this is a one-time thing or I’m being hyperbolic, and this really did just happen. Here, the Telegraph article on this. , A German woman for finding out a gang rapist of a 15-year-old girl, an underage girl who was Muslim, calling him a pig for doing this, was given a longer prison sentence than he was given.[00:32:44] This is where the left is. This is where the mainstream left is[00:32:48] Malcolm Collins: the fights that happened on 4chan, if you look back in the day that led to Trump becoming the v- the nominee to begin with, ‘cause that was the first place he was really supported there[00:32:58] How many people were likely involved in that? 15,000 maybe? 10,000? Mm. Not that many. You, you don’t need that many people to change a country or a culture. You just have to be having the fight where it matters. In the, in the same way if you look at the, the left fight, you’re like, how much does it really matter that the Islamist faction is, is gaining toll, like the anti-Western faction?[00:33:20] Look at, one, the leftist drop of policies like environmentalism, right? Like that, that has a, that’s been a huge policy change on the left. The leftist rise, because the left used to be generally anti-immigration because they were pro-worker, of all of this incredibly aggressive pro-immigration sentiment.[00:33:41] Or even the hiding of the Griper games to begin with. That’s not a normal thing for a leftist to do, to try to hide a Islam- well, not even Islamist, in that case just Muslim rape network. That’s a, that’s not a, a leftist thing to want to do. That’s a very specific sub-ideology e- even where the left had been focused a lot of its attention now.[00:34:02] The Dorian Montdami battle. That’s the most important city in America, Simone, right? Like, that’s Manhattan, okay? That, that, the destiny side has lost this ideological battle existentially matters. And I think what we’re seeing here is all of the PACs in the world can’t affect a thing. All of the, all of these people who used to think their dark money whatever was gonna affect everything, was gonna control politics.[00:34:28] Kamala outraised Trump 3X. You know, you talk about like- Gosh,[00:34:33] Simone Collins: was it really 3X?[00:34:34] Malcolm Collins: It was 3X. You talk about big don- It just doesn’t matter anymore. It’s the culture war that matters[00:34:41] Simone Collins: My gosh[00:34:42] Malcolm Collins: So like we need to capture institutions that’s useful to do when we can do it or build new institutions like we’re doing with rfab.ai, right?[00:34:52] Like we’ll, we’ll build the best AI agents and the best AI chatbots and the best AI image and video generation and, and games and everything. Like we go at this from a, we have to own the, the institutions that are the most important within the next generation and the AI platforms are one of those things, right?[00:35:10] Like- Hmm ... that’s why we’ve gone after that and our audience has a lot of things that I’d like to see them go after, right? Because you know, th- that’s, that’s the foot soldiers who are making this stuff happen. So this is, this is one of those things where somebody’s like, does this stupid... It- it’s, it goes to the person who, you know, when, back when I was at the GSB, they were like, “Why, why are you concerned with this 4chan Tumblr battle?[00:35:32] It’s never gonna matter in anything.” And it’s like, oh, the, the battle that happened for what is right culture in these little platforms all the way back then, all these early content creators, these ended up defining two cultures, right? Like, like the people who are like, “Oh, this little Tumblr weird xeno gender whatever,” that’s never gonna be mainstream, right?[00:35:54] Like why, why participate in that fight? Why participate in the, one of the big cultural battles back then [00:36:00] that really matters that it, it, it... who won, was the too cutes versus the true scups. For anyone who, who was around, that was happening within that little leftist ecosystem. Hmm. How many people were genuinely involved in the too cutes versus the too cutes versus the true scups?[00:36:13] That might’ve been like 5,000 people, thir- 3,000 people? For people who are unaware, this battle was some people said being trans is something that you are born as and you cannot change, and it is a medical condition that you need to be diagnosed with because it’s a serious and real thing. And then the too cutes said, “Well, how can you say that?[00:36:33] Anyone can say they’re trans whenever they feel like it. Anyone can say they’re whatever gender they want whenever they feel like it. You don’t get to gate what trans is. Trans is an emotion. Trans is in the moment. Trans is, you know, a, an i- a, a social movement,” right? And they, they, they won hard.[00:36:50] And now you can’t say, and some people get surprised, like old leftists are like, “But isn’t trans like something you’re born as?” And then the people are like, “No, that’s a very transphobic thing to say.” You know, “That’s, that’s a very true scummy thing to say.” They’re just not familiar with like the, the downstream politics, but this has mattered a lot in terms of like these, these gender, the stuff that’s being taught in schools.[00:37:10] The stuff that’s being taught in schools is like from Tumblr, right? The, the, the, the presentations you’re forced to sit through at work. These don’t come from the old fogey Democrats’ idea of what DEI was.[00:37:22] Simone Collins: Hmm. Yeah. No, this is not what they envisioned, to be fair. We saw the vision of DEI in the early ‘90s when every TV show had the kid with the wheelchair, the Native American kid, the Chinese kid- Yeah[00:37:40] the Midwestern kid, ‘cause they were diversity, too. Midwesterns, wow, what’s that?[00:37:44] Malcolm Collins: Oh no, Asians? No, they don’t count at all.[00:37:47] Simone Collins: Yeah, Asians don’t show up, Native Americans show up. Where are the kids in the wheelchairs? They’re gone. Gone.[00:37:52] Malcolm Collins: Hispanics are actually, in terms of movies, the, the least represented ethnic group- Yeah, where have they gone?[00:37:57] compared in contrast with their portion of the population. What’s[00:37:58] Simone Collins: going on there? Yes,[00:38:00] Malcolm Collins: that, that’s also very strange. They don’t care. They don’t care. They de- they defined a few ethnicities and groups that had value y- you know, Muslims and Blacks, and then they, they rank them, right? And trans people, right?[00:38:09] It’s like those are, those are gonna be our groups going forwards. And g- a, a gay cis is basically a white male, right? You know, just increasingly creating this sort of hierarchy within their spaces. So yeah, no, I, I mean, I mean, it matters. These, these battles that seem absurd become the culture of tomorrow.[00:38:25] And I’m honestly shocked that, like, the mainstream think tanks don’t get this[00:38:35] Simone Collins: Hmm. Well, do they have a, a financial incentive to, though? I mean, a mainstream think tank lives at the whims of their donors, and their donors don’t know about this, so w- they would only- Tru- ... get in trouble for catering to this group because their donors would be like, “What is this strange-”[00:38:49] Malcolm Collins: I mean, I thought-[00:38:50] Simone Collins: thing on the internet? There’s a blue man who says he’s Jewish. I don’t understand it.” And[00:38:56] Malcolm Collins: they would be very confused. The group that’s been best at handling this has been The Heritage Foundation.[00:38:59] Simone Collins: They’re honestly fantastic, yeah ...[00:39:01] they- Like, they actually are plugged in and it’s amazing.[00:39:03] Malcolm Collins: They, they had, I mean, obviously I see that the Nick Fuentes/Griper faction as our primary ideological enemy, like their, our core-est, most direct foe in terms of the future of the country.[00:39:14] And I would still applaud that The Heritage Foundation did say that it was okay that Nick Fuentes appeared on whatever show. Like, remember when that happened and they got in trouble for doing that? I was like, that-[00:39:24] Oh ...[00:39:24] that, that was actually you know, it, it, it at least showed that they were open to the new factions that are fighting and they’ve always been open to us and willing to see where that goes from, from where we are today.[00:39:36] Hmm.[00:39:37] And I don’t, I don’t know where that goes. I don’t know where that goes. But what I w- but what I would say is, is at least The Heritage is open to it, but I think that a lot of these foundations, if I were them, I’d be putting money into it. I, I would be. I-[00:39:46] Simone Collins: How? What would that even look like?[00:39:49] Malcolm Collins: It... Right now, Nux is demonetized from YouTube. Why don’t you fund him, Jews? I mean, he’s the core, like, ideologically relevant Jew on the right right now. [00:40:00] W- where’s all your Jew gold now?[00:40:02] Speaker 4: I want your Jew gold[00:40:04] Okay, fine. Here. Now let’s go. Do you think I’m stupid? I know that all Jews carry fake bags of gold around their necks to keep the real bags of gold around their necks safe. Hand over the real Jew gold, calf[00:40:16] Simone Collins: No, it’s true when, when you look at, like, what think tanks are putting out and their reach versus what Nux puts out, its alignment with their values and his reach, it is kind of insane that, like, think tank money is going to them.[00:40:30] One thing that gives me hope on this front, though, something that recently popped up that people were talking about on X, is that the Trump administration is shifting funding in scientific development from things like academic institutions, which no one trusts anymore anyway, to just individual scientists and AI.[00:40:48] Malcolm Collins: Oh, great.[00:40:49] Simone Collins: And that is a sign to me that maybe we’ll see people f- possibly following the lead placed by the administration in that, “Hey, look, we’re, we’re not going to invest in institutions that don’t show an ROI.” I do think that there are some, like, I think Heritage Foundation makes a difference, a big difference.[00:41:08] It has been powerful since the early ‘90s or earlier, right? But- I don’t know of many think tanks that are really... Oh, there’s the other one that, like, mints conservative justices, which is also one.[00:41:20] Malcolm Collins: That’s the the Catholic one. Whatever are they called? The-[00:41:22] Simone Collins: Yeah, that, that one I, yeah, I think that one’s really powerful.[00:41:25] So that, those two are the ones I think- Those[00:41:27] Malcolm Collins: two-[00:41:28] Simone Collins: Yeah.[00:41:28] Malcolm Collins: No, there’s a, there’s, I mean, there’s other ones that are trying to matter and that did-[00:41:31] Simone Collins: Trying to matter r- is different from actually mattering. And when I see- Yeah, they[00:41:34] Malcolm Collins: did use to shape ideology upstream. But what, but the- Oh,[00:41:37] Simone Collins: there was the Southern Poverty Law Center that kept racism alive, which is great, you know?[00:41:41] Malcolm Collins: No, but not a conservative. No, I mean, there was a lot of, like, the Manhattan Institute, all that. There was a lot of conservative think tanks. And their goal presumably was, like, let’s get all the young intellectual conservatives, capture them in our institution, pay them, have them put out the stuff, and then we will subtly influence the stuff and them, right?[00:42:00] Hmm. And that, that is not what they do anymore. Now they just hire people who already agree with them, largely speaking, and don’t really have intellectual influence which is catastrophically stupid. But it, I think it’s because as you said, for them it’s about an optics for their donors.[00:42:19] It’s not about actually winning the fight.[00:42:25] Simone Collins: Yeah. And I mean, how much do donors actually care?[00:42:29] Malcolm Collins: I mean, if anyone out there is willing to start, like, a real fund to actually influence the culture war, like, go for it, man. We’ll, we’ll support you where we can.[00:42:36] Simone Collins: I don’t... I mean, like-[00:42:38] Malcolm Collins: I was thinking about doing it ...[00:42:39] Simone Collins: if if someone were paid by a major think tank, w- don’t, wouldn’t their audience not see them as being legitimate anymore?[00:42:50] Malcolm Collins: No. Charlie Kirk got major investments from think take, tank groups. Oh,[00:42:54] Simone Collins: that’s a fair point. Yeah.[00:42:55] Malcolm Collins: They, they tried to capture him, and, like, when the J- Jewish Orthodox state, he was just like, “I’m, I’m just gonna get angrier the more you try to capture me.” Mm-hmm. Don’t try that.” Which we saw from his, his private writings.[00:43:04] But yeah, but they attempted to influence the cultural battle by influencing Charlie Kirk. So they could recognize it at, like, one stage. I mean, actually, one of the groups that was the smartest in doing this but sort of fell apart was the Daily Wire. They said, “We’re gonna capture conservative culture, not with the institutions, but at the level of the influencers.”[00:43:24] And so they would pick out promising influencers and then shape them.[00:43:26] Simone Collins: That’s true. Yes. Okay, you’re right. They are an example of an organization that did this, but they kept losing control.[00:43:33] Bye. Bye. Love you, buddy. Come right back if she’s not out. Okay, bye. Thanks. S- you know how Octavian has a problem with boundaries and phones?[00:43:42] Malcolm Collins: Mm-hmm.[00:43:43] Simone Collins: But he’s like, “Well, just make a command so I can’t call her until after 4:00 PM.” And I bet that there’s some kind of random, like- blank smartphone that you can get that [00:44:00] ha- you have AI run that can do- Yeah[00:44:02] things like that. Like, listen to your kid all the time through the device. That’s what I’m building.[00:44:06] Malcolm Collins: That’s what I’m[00:44:06] Simone Collins: building. You can’t make calls on it, though.[00:44:09] Malcolm Collins: The RFAB device, I mean, I can make it make calls. Do you want me to make it make calls? We have the whole thing set up to make calls.[00:44:14] Simone Collins: You’re right, it can make calls, but can you make calls through it?[00:44:18] Malcolm Collins: I could do that. That would be trivially easy.[00:44:21] Simone Collins: That would be really cool if, if you could, like, set up contacts that your kid can call through the device via WiFi.[00:44:28] Malcolm Collins: I guess, yeah, like a cheap AI device the kid can have with them anywhere that’s also a cellphone. That’s quite good, yeah.[00:44:33] Simone Collins: Yeah. That- that allows them to, you know, tell their AI companion to call their parents for them or something.[00:44:38] Like, “Call mom.”[00:44:38] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I can do that.[00:44:40] Simone Collins: Yeah. “Call my friend.”[00:44:42] Malcolm Collins: Okay. Okay,[00:44:43] Simone Collins: Simone. And then the AI can monitor the call. Make sure everything’s okay.[00:44:49] Malcolm Collins: Okay, Simone. Sorry, I- A cool idea, actually. So That’s actually a good idea ... yeah, we can do that with the RFAB device. I’ll- I’ll have it ready in a few weeks, people.[00:44:55] Sorry, we recorded this episode a little bit ago, so that feature is already live. The RFAB apps are working mostly as far as I know. If anything’s broken, let me know[00:45:05] Malcolm Collins: Next new feature, getting called[00:45:07] Simone Collins: out on. You’re working so hard. I’m sorry. I overwork you. I need to-[00:45:13] Malcolm Collins: But- ... give you a break ... on the subject that[00:45:16] Simone Collins: we, With regard to political relevancy, very good point that the Daily Wire was trying to be that. Like, “Hey, here are influencers. I will bring them under my wing, and they will shape what it means to be conservative.”[00:45:29] And I feel like they effectively did that for a while. Maybe they still effectively do that as much as ever. No, they, they, they- It’s now common knowledge that they’re botting.[00:45:36] Malcolm Collins: No, they- ... they effectively did that for a while. They don’t do it[00:45:39] Simone Collins: anymore ... for a while. So I guess what went wrong? They- they spent a whole bunch of money making a fantasy series?[00:45:45] Malcolm Collins: No, what went wrong is two big things. One is, is that they didn’t understand that it was better to side with the faction that was like, “No giving aid to Israel,” but like, we can do things that are aligned occasionally, right? Mm-hmm. Like, which is really what the nerd right has, has come to take as their position.[00:46:05] Which is like it is stupid that we are still giving Israel aid. Israel should be showing us more respect than they’re showing us, but that doesn’t mean that we should reflectively hurt our own interests just to hurt Israel. That was not a, a position that the, the, the, the Daily Wire was going to be okay with taking.[00:46:22] And because of that the, they couldn’t work with the nerd right as the nerd right grew which just completely scuttled them. Also, the, the, the phobia of stuff like anime and pornography and stuff like that, that has always been pretty central to the... Like, sexy women has always been central to the nerd right identity, right?[00:46:43] And he would’ve been completely unable to be like- Yeah, you, you don’t need to explicitly, like, hide sexy sexy women. Like, that, that’s not a... So I think that those things were just like he couldn’t get his head around them. And it, it seemed like weird internet nerds that he didn’t need to care about.[00:47:02] And so he tried to create an enemy of a group that should have been his most likely ally.[00:47:09] Hmm.[00:47:09] And through doing that, completely lost the audience that was looking for, like, an authentic pro-America vision, because it really began to feel like a first and foremost pro-Israel vision. A- and, and as well pro-censorship, you know, that he’s like, “How can you say this?[00:47:25] How can you say this?” You can’t do that and, and be an authentic, like, within the nerd right cultural sphere individual. And that was- That[00:47:32] Simone Collins: used to be how it was, to be[00:47:34] Malcolm Collins: fair ... it used to be how it was, and he just didn’t grok that it had changed.[00:47:37] Simone Collins: Hmm.[00:47:38] Malcolm Collins: Or was changing, or that some other group was beating him out.[00:47:41] And then the second big mistake he made was antagonizing the people under his influence who ha- gained a lot of power. Like the, the Bret Cooper thing, the thing with Candace Owens. Those, those are totally on-him losses. Like, he could still control those sources of [00:48:00] influence, and now each of them has significantly more influence than the entire Daily Wire combined.[00:48:04] Right? So, like, how do you f**k that up so badly, Ben? Like, I don’t know. It’s just really stupid, stupid stuff. A- and also, the people that he chose to be sort of his influencers showed him being out of touch with who the culturally relevant parts of the right are actually listening to. Mm-hmm ... not a lot of, like, the culturally relevant, like, get into White House, get into power people, watch the people under the Daily Wire sphere of influence.[00:48:32] Th- they’re, they’re sort of, like, the last generation of-[00:48:36] Simone Collins: That’s a good point, actually. Yeah, like, the, the kind of audience that I understand to be watching Bret Cooper are really nice, young conservative-leaning women, but they’re not Planning to destabilize nations or, like, change policy significantly as a politician, for example.[00:48:57] Yeah ... so you, you, you are swaying them as voters maybe, but that at best and maybe, maybe not even that. Well, and Candace Owens, I do see a slightly higher agency potential with the group listening to her, but-[00:49:11] Malcolm Collins: No, C- Candace Owens has gotten her hooks in the actual culture war figures.[00:49:15] Simone Collins: Yeah.[00:49:16] Malcolm Collins: She, she is, I would say on the griper side, one of the core generals.[00:49:21] She may not identify as a griper herself, but it clearly anti, anti-Israel is her core ideology, and everything is downstream of that, which is part of the griper identity. So, yeah, she’s definitely just, like, fully on that side[00:49:38] Simone Collins: Yeah, but I think that anyone who really gets into her content is Too likely to be conspiracy brained themselves to the point where they are not going to be as effective in their work as other people[00:49:50] Malcolm Collins: True, true.[00:49:51] That, that, that may be the case. I mean, it’s, it’s not the best strategy. But I mean, the people who get into Hasan’s content also become very conspiratorially brained[00:50:02] Simone Collins: Do they? Is he a conspiracy person? I don’t think he is[00:50:04] Malcolm Collins: I mean, I think he’s... Yeah, he’s not as bad as, like, Candace Owens.[00:50:08] You’re right about that.[00:50:08] Simone Collins: Well, no one, I mean, Candace Owens... I mean, Alex Jones has fewer conspiracy theories than Candace Owens. She makes Alex Jones look like the most... I mean, well, and the thing is, Alex Jones has pointed to so many things that have turned out to be true.[00:50:24] Malcolm Collins: Well, I actually think that this is- That’s what we’re gonna do with him[00:50:25] this is the core reason the Graper’s lost-[00:50:28] Simone Collins: Mm-hmm ...[00:50:28] Malcolm Collins: actually. Is Nick did a very bad job of raising a cohesive set of generals to push his ideology. He raised like, there were a number of people like Candace Owens who were sort of operating on their own, and then the people directly under him within the Graper army, as he calls it, were way too far under him, right?[00:50:50] Mm. Like, they, they did not have a degree of autonomy. They basically just follow what he’s putting out and signal boost it. And that does not a strong movement create. Where if you look at the nerd right, it’s a collection of loosely allied friendly factions that have similar goals and are willing to compromise and think independently.[00:51:15] Like, you, there, there is no equivalent in the Graper faction of Asmongold/Nux/Leaflet/You/Me/Powder/ you know, Kirsche/ you know, any of the other dozen, Tech Tone any, any of the other dozen creators that are you know, downstream of this space. They’re just not represented. And I think it’s because, one of the reasons why we’ve been able to do this is because a lot of the nerd right has gone really out of its way to help people that are, that are rising influencers.[00:51:44] Simone Collins: Yeah. That’s one of the biggest things I’ve, I’ve noticed in spaces that are up and coming and really flourishing, is that people within them introduce people to each other. Whereas the ones that are dying, there’s a ton of gatekeeping. Yeah ... and to the point, like, what was [00:52:00] this whole podcast about, but literal gatekeeping.[00:52:04] Malcolm Collins: Yeah.[00:52:04] Simone Collins: So I don’t have a whole lot of hope for that faction.[00:52:07] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, like- And I would like to not mention them ... like Nux coming on our show, for example.[00:52:11] Simone Collins: Yeah, I mean, he’s, he’s so much bigger than us. He could’ve easily have written us off and never been willing to talk with a, us. I mean, Leaflet too, right?[00:52:19] She’s way bigger than us, and she, you know, you get to go on her, her stream every other week, which is so cool and so fun. There, whereas I feel like if that had happened in one of these other communities, and not just progressives, you know, conservatives too, if it were, like, the Daily Wire universe, w- we would not be allowed in the room at all, never.[00:52:40] Even, like, when we went to the Arc Conference, which was more of the Ben Shapiro, Jordan Peterson sphere of the conservative space- Yeah ... it felt so gatekeep-y.[00:52:50] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, be- there[00:52:51] Simone Collins: were[00:52:51] Malcolm Collins: a ton of people at the event who were nerd right content creators, big ones. Like, Sargon of Akkad was there, right? Like,[00:53:00] Simone Collins: who shouldn’t- A lot of big D- yeah, very big deal people, and what did they do?[00:53:03] They literally shoved all attendees into a giant audience room and yelled at them if they were outside it talking and networking with each other, and made them all listen to their chosen lineup of their chosen conservative leaders who didn’t have anything interesting to say. It was, like, whiny, and it was, “Okay, Jordan[00:53:23] Malcolm Collins: Peterson,” whatever.[00:53:24] It was very vanilla and whiny. Yeah. And it ended up, I think, just... When I was there, and, you know, I see Edward Dutton and I see Sargon of Akkad and I see the Dad Saves America, and not one of them is on stage. Not one of the actual people with an audience is on stage. Yeah, dude.[00:53:39] Simone Collins: What’s up with that?[00:53:40] Malcolm Collins: I was like, “Oh,” and obviously I’m there, and I’m hugely insulted that I’m not on stage.[00:53:45] I’m like, “What are you guys even doing?” Like, Mm ... this is not how you influ- this is not how you play the culture war, right? You, you, you idio- imbeciles. You, you give the people with audiences money, not these jackoffs.[00:54:01] Simone Collins: Yeah. It was but that, that is that faction. So this is not exactly just, not even close to just a thing of, that people on the left[00:54:10] Malcolm Collins: do.[00:54:10] No, the ARC faction was the so just for people that are aware of, the faction that they were trying to influence everything in favor of I’d call it the fuddy-duddy English conservative. It’s not even a thing in the United States. You know, the, the things that they’re afraid of are violence against women and pornography that sort of stuff, right?[00:54:28] Like-[00:54:28] Simone Collins: Even though they’re the ones that want it.[00:54:30] Malcolm Collins: Yeah.[00:54:33] Simone Collins: Men don’t wanna do... Most men do not want to do that because they, most men are also subs in the end.[00:54:39] Malcolm Collins: She’s, she’s talking statistically there. Yeah. They’re... I, I, I know, I think it’s, that males are more statistically likely to be doms, but they are still overwhelmingly, like, like way more of our subs- Yeah, they’re way[00:54:51] Simone Collins: more statistically, yeah.[00:54:51] But it’s like, you know- ...[00:54:52] Malcolm Collins: do, are for women ...[00:54:53] Simone Collins: 40% versus, like, you know, 10% of women.[00:54:58] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, yeah.[00:54:59] Simone Collins: Even if that, if that 10% of women. But[00:55:01] Malcolm Collins: the, the point being is, like, that was the type of stuff they were lecturing us about.[00:55:06] Simone Collins: Mm.[00:55:06] Malcolm Collins: And I was like, what, what, you guys are so f*****g out of touch. Like, the, the, you’re not, the, that faction, I didn’t even label them as one of the factions ‘cause they basically only exist in the UK.[00:55:17] They’re incredibly depressed every time you talk to them. They’re just like, “Well, we’re just losing everything,” you know? “Oh, no, no, no.” You know?[00:55:24] Simone Collins: Well, so here’s[00:55:25] Malcolm Collins: the, here’s the question. They get mad at you and you’re like, “Well, kick out all the i- immigrants.” And they’re like, “Well, that would be quite an extremist opinion.”[00:55:31] And it’s like, no. Can get a tractor and just b- plow down their, their neighborhoods, right? Like, we can, we can build a condo there or something. Get ‘em out. Get ‘em out.[00:55:41] Simone Collins: But on the left, I think what you really are missing and what I kept expect- You did mention his name, but I was expecting you to say that, like, the big growing faction that actually is worth watching now is the, the Momdani faction, the Momdaner party, the Grand Momdani.[00:55:56] The Momdani[00:55:57] Malcolm Collins: is the Islamist faction[00:55:59] Simone Collins: It’s, but it’s [00:56:00] not... I don’t, I mean, are Hasan and Mondami friends? At, at the very least, like- Yeah, yeah, yeah. They went to- But Mondami is the leader. Like, he is the person to watch, and he is an elected politician. So your- He is someone who can affect policy ... Simone,[00:56:12] Malcolm Collins: you’re asking a bunch of questions, like people don’t know the answer to these questions.[00:56:15] So, yes, they are directly connected. Okay. Hasan worked to campaign for Mondami and then he was slighted and not allowed in the Mondami campaign parties which was one of the reasons why- I didn’t know that ... I thought that he had lost the battle. So we do know- Hmm ... they are direct ideological allies.[00:56:34] They have almost every single point that each of them cares about, the other one cares about. Hmm. They are the exact same faction. There is no difference. A, a, M- Mondami might be... In the same way that, and I think you’re wrong to say that Mondami’s, like, the leader of it. In the same way that you could say somebody like JD Vance- I-[00:56:54] or like Peter Thiel- Hmm ... or like, Hmm ...[00:56:55] Simone Collins: the, the people that, that I see on the left who are, like followers but influential who, like ident- they, they, their identity is, “I’m a leftist,” they don’t talk about Hasan. They don’t talk about Destiny. They certainly don’t talk about Nick Fuentes I guess, even though he’s trying.[00:57:14] They talk about Mondami. They don’t talk about anyone else, not even AOC because- Well,[00:57:18] Malcolm Collins: that’s, this group is the, the group that you listen to, the let’s not make a bother leftists. Like, they’re, they’re, they’re, they’re- They’re[00:57:25] Simone Collins: not let’s not make a bother people, no.[00:57:28] Malcolm Collins: They’re in, they’re in the Destiny camp.[00:57:30] They’re mostly, like, pro-gay stuff, pro... So they are, they h- historically are pro that stuff. They don’t really get what Mondami’s really about. They don’t really listen to what Mondami’s really about. They see a lot of excitement for him, and so they try to get on that. But I just think that they mostly are unaware.[00:57:48] They’re- Hmm ... they, they understand, like, colonizer theory and everything, which was written by Mondami’s dad. See our episode on that. But,[00:57:55] Simone Collins: That was crazy. It’s, yeah, what a family. Power family. See, new political- Yeah ... royalty. It’s all there. It’s all there. But[00:58:01] Malcolm Collins: they, this stuff is written by his dad, but they don’t agree with all of that, or they are unaware that that is what this faction stands for, and that’s a large way that this faction’s been able to gain so much power on the left.[00:58:11] It’s just I didn’t expect them to gain this much institutional power on the left which I think we will see in the next leftist candidate running for president. Or, or we will see a major pretty explicitly Islamist candidate running, I think. I don’t know if he’d win the primaries, but I think we’ll see it[00:58:27] Simone Collins: Yeah, I’m so looking forward to that.[00:58:30] When, when, when is the next presidential... We have a long way to go[00:58:33] Malcolm Collins: between midterms here- I mean, you look at, like, Mondavi’s staff, and, like, his key person who ran his, like, housing thing was like, “[00:58:40] So for example, , she calls to impoverish the white middle class. Homeownership is racist and a failed public policy. , She said no more white men in office platform. , She said this country has built wealth for white people through generations, slavery, stolen land and labor, white supremacy built the North and the South.[00:59:02] She said-- By the way, in case you’re wondering, , slavery impoverished the South. Slavery economically set back the South. , This is what all mainstream economists think. She said the KKK are a violent Christian group. To keep us all safe and busy, travel today. Delta should kick white people in its Xmas outfits off planes.[00:59:23] , She said, , after encountering an eleven-year-old group of white boys, “I don’t know why keep pro-procreating.” , So she’s a massively, massively racist individual, and this is who he’s putting into power. , You can look at his dressed-up version of Islamism and think-- or anti-Westernism and think, “Oh, , this is, this is, , about social what-” No.[00:59:48] No, no, no. That’s not who he’s hiring. That’s not who he’s staffing. He is above all else an Islamist and anti-white candidate.[00:59:57] Malcolm Collins: You know, I, I, I hate all white people. We should, [01:00:00] you know, get rid of a b- get rid of white people,” you know, et cetera.[01:00:03] Like, they’re, they’re, they’re explicitly in this, like, “Yeah, our job is crushing Western civilization.”[01:00:11] Simone Collins: Hmm. Well-[01:00:12] Malcolm Collins: More than anything else ...[01:00:14] Simone Collins: that’s, I say that’s the faction to, to watch. I’m not watching Hasan. I don’t think people... I don’t even think that the people who watch Hasan watch him for his political opinions.[01:00:24] I, I, I genuinely think that the person who emailed us- Clearly he[01:00:27] Malcolm Collins: has influence if he was able to be at the major DNC for youth event and control who can enter.[01:00:33] Simone Collins: Right, because he, he’s, That’s like saying someone who, who wears Chanel designs for Chanel. No, he wears Chanel. He wears ready-to-wear. It-[01:00:42] Malcolm Collins: That’s not...[01:00:43] No, that’s not... Simone, it’s the ma- the DNC controls who the primary candidate win. Like, they basically chose the last presidential candidate for the Democratic voters. Okay? Their level of centralized control is astonishing. That they are taking shot calls from Hasan shows a level of influence that you are pretending isn’t there.[01:01:07] Simone Collins: I c- I c- I just only, I can only imagine that he, there was something that we don’t know, ‘cause it’s otherwise so inexplicable to me. It wouldn’t be good for content. It would be better for there to be some-[01:01:18] Malcolm Collins: It’s a power[01:01:18] Simone Collins: play- ... confrontation ...[01:01:19] Malcolm Collins: Simone. I- if anything, he’s making it clear how much power he has over the DNC.[01:01:24] Simone Collins: Hmm. I don’t k- maybe, maybe you’re right. I don’t know. I, I’m sure everyone will tell me how wrong I am in the comments.[01:01:29] Malcolm Collins: We’ll see. People in the comments- How st- ... weigh in. Let[01:01:31] Simone Collins: us know ... stupid I am. Yeah.[01:01:33] Malcolm Collins: So quesadillas.[01:01:35] Simone Collins: Quesadillas.[01:01:35] Malcolm Collins: And very, very excited for that. Mm-hmm. And I love you. And have a good one.[01:01:41] Simone Collins: I love you too, gorgeous. I will let you know dinner’s ready.[01:01:43] Malcolm Collins: Okay.[01:01:44] Simone Collins: or tariffs. So there’s just n- there, you would, you would never. Even though they’re so affordable, there’s no way you could buy one of the really cool Chinese electric vehicles, which makes me mad because I[01:01:57] Malcolm Collins: don’t know. Don’t they, like, explode?[01:02:01] Simone Collins: Whatever. Sometimes Such a prude[01:02:08] Malcolm Collins: Oh my God. Yeah, that’s a, that’s a lux setup she’s got there.[01:02:11] Simone Collins: I know, right? But this is a whole genre. You don’t understand. She’s not the only creator. She is just one. There’s one that lives in this, like, double-decker mobile home that’s, like, all rickety and kind of... It, it’s like Howl’s Moving Castle if you had a re- like, real. It’s so crazy. And then there’s another one.[01:02:28] Oh, and that same woman also has this extra super tiny car that she somehow turns into, like, she’ll, like, cook hot pot meals in it, and then she’ll turn it into a bed, but it’s, like, the size of a tiny clown car. Like, w- half the size of your Mazda. And then there’s another woman who has a totally different little...[01:02:45] It, it looks almost like it’s a little tiny train car. This is a... I, I’ve fallen down this rabbit hole. But you do have to stop and think, “Why are there all these homeless women in China with their pink little setups?” Why are they... W- like, I... There is one at least who even recently posted, like, “Well, I quit my job,” but did she quit her job or was she laid off?[01:03:07] Is she okay? Like, what’s going on? It’s worrying But no, they have, like, full out bathtubs in these sometimes. They line them with plastic. It’s very strange. I don’t know where they use the bathroom. But yeah, it’s like the, the Chinese version of van life is so much cooler than American van life.[01:03:27] American van life makes it look like we’re living in the 1850s. Chinese van life is the way to go. Well, I think it- I have to be a van life influencer ... the[01:03:36] Malcolm Collins: van life here is sort of faked with stuff that wouldn’t actually work, whereas American van life is real van life. I was looking at her setup and it didn’t look like it would actually work in real life.[01:03:44] Simone Collins: But it... But she did. She did it in real life. What do you mean? What would not work? What would not work about that setup? Tell me.[01:03:51] Malcolm Collins: It’s, it’s like an inflatable house. Like, it, it- Yeah ... inflatables- That were by her car ... are generally incredibly non-stable. The only way you get a [01:04:00] stable inflatable is by constantly running a fan and doing, like, the types they have at fairs and stuff like that.[01:04:04] Simone Collins: Yeah, that’s what her car has.[01:04:06] Malcolm Collins: It didn’t look like that. It looked like a normal inflatable, like if you popped it, it would just pop.[01:04:12] Simone Collins: Yeah.[01:04:12] Malcolm Collins: And that... No, th- that’s, that doesn’t work.[01:04:15] Simone Collins: What do you mean that d- We, we put inflatables in our house all the time.[01:04:19] Malcolm Collins: No, we do a type where you’re blowing it with a fan to keep it inflated constantly, and it’s expected that air is constantly leaking from[01:04:26] Simone Collins: it.[01:04:26] And that is what is happening with hers.[01:04:28] Malcolm Collins: No, it’s not. Did you look at it? It was plastic and see-through. The ones that you constantly pump air into are always fabric.[01:04:36] Simone Collins: That was... It was... It’s plastic fabric. You know it’s plastic fabric, right? It’s a thick plastic. No, I mean, it, it- It’s just that that had clear windows- It’s like-[01:04:43] and then it had tubes. It had the support tubes to hold up the thing, and the support tubes are-[01:04:46] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, literally look at it. The support tubes were the t-[01:04:49] Simone Collins: Constantly inflated with air ...[01:04:50] Malcolm Collins: yes, the type of inflatable that is plastic, right, and clear- Mm-hmm ... like a beach ball.[01:04:57] Simone Collins: No, that was the window. It wasn’t inflated.[01:04:59] The support beams were inflated. We could argue about it, I guess. I don- I, I think you’re wrong about[01:05:04] Malcolm Collins: this. It’s a fake-[01:05:05] Simone Collins: Malcolm- You c- Inflatables- Look at it ... of that[01:05:07] Malcolm Collins: variety- It’s a thing ... do not work at[01:05:08] Simone Collins: that size. She pulled it into the back of her car and she inflated it. I don’t know, like, wh- how and why would you fake that?[01:05:14] It would be harder- For[01:05:15] Malcolm Collins: views. It looks[01:05:17] Simone Collins: cool. No, that’s a product. I’m sure if I clicked on her links, I would find that product. No, I’m sure it’s a[01:05:21] Malcolm Collins: product, but it would break in a day and a half.[01:05:24] Simone Collins: Well, no, she put down a mat so the grass doesn’t, like, break it. Oh my God. It’s a mat. You’re[01:05:29] Malcolm Collins: so credulous.[01:05:30] Incredulous.[01:05:32] I, I can’t remember the word.[01:05:33] Simone Collins: No, I am credulous. Okay. Incredulous is you doubt. Credulous is you’re like, “Yeah, let’s go.”[01:05:37] Malcolm Collins: Yeah.[01:05:41] Speaker 9: What are you two doing?[01:06:19] Daddy is a boobie head. Daddy is a boobie head. Daddy is a boobie head This is a public episode. 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