Jason Goldman, one of the world's foremost Dune podcast pioneers, talks about all of the Dune books, all of the Dune movies, the Dune TV shows, democracy, institutions, the dangers of charismatic leaders, the (a)moral arc of technological progress, the potential of governing with data, and how so many technologists miss the point of the literature they love.

Tim O’Reilly is our first guest, ostensibly to talk about Dune, but we end up talking about much more, including mysticism, poetry, philosophy, leadership, and our responsibility as humans to transcend our limits.