We talk with legal scholar-journalist Julia Powles who has done some deep dives into the world of Alphabet’s Deep Mind’s relationship with NHS data. Our conversation starts with Julia’s collaborator, Hal Hodson, and his reporting on Deep Mind for the New Scientist. Julia explains the findings of the Information Commissioner and the subtle intersection of the Data Protection Act 1998 and the “boot out” to the Caldicott Guidelines. The relevance to the U.S. is confirmed with discussions of the “first mover” advantages in establishing data market power, the problems associated with the privatization of public health data, and the “transparency paradox” associated with big data companies.