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September 19, 2019
Pete Holmes returns for a conversation with Michael Gungor and Science Mike to discuss his latest book, Comedy Sex God. This episode was sponsored by Betterhelp. Get 10% your first month of safe, private, affordable mental health counseling by visiting http://betterhelp.com/liturgists.
September 12, 2019
It's ENNEAGRAM MADNESS. Today we have not one, not two, but three episodes about the Enneagram featuring one of our favorite teachers: Annie Dimond. This episode was sponsored by Betterhelp. Get 10% your first month of safe, private, affordable mental health counseling by visiting http://betterhelp.com/liturgists. Annie Dimond is a teacher of the Enneagram Personality and a PhD Student of Practical Theology at The University of Aberdeen in Scotland. In this episode, Annie and Mike McHargue dive deeper into the Enneagram by exploring its 27 subtypes and how it can act as a map for healing and self-acceptance.    To learn more about Annie Dimond, visit her website: enneagramforwholeness.com   For more about Ryan O'Neal and his music visit: sleepingatlast.com   To learn more about Enneagram Subtypes:  The Complete Enneagram: 27 Paths to Greater Self-Awareness by Beatrice Chestnut BRIEF DESCRIPTION OF CENTERS OF INTELLIGENCE AND PERCEPTION (enneagramworldwide.com)   8,9, 1 - Body or Gut Type Body-based types lead with the body for movement, sensate awareness and gut-level knowing. Their focus is on personal security, control, social belonging and taking right action. Also known as the Instinctual Center.   5,6,7 - Head Type Thinking-based, head types lead with ideas, gathering information, figuring things out and rational decision-making before acting. Their focus is on creating certainty and safety, or finding multiple options. Also known as the Intellectual Center. 2,3,4 - Heart Type Feeling-based types emphasize the heart for positive and negative feelings, empathy and concern for others, romance and devotion. Their focus is on success and relationship, performing up to expectations of the job or other people. Also known as the Emotional Center.   BRIEF DESCRIPTION OF THE SUBTYPES -  (enneagramworldwide.com)   Our evolution as human beings has required three basic survival strategies, known as the basic instincts: Self-preservation – responding to perceived threats and needs Social – creating social structures within communities One-to-one – primary relationships or coupling TYPE 2 - THE GIVER Self-preservation: Privilege – The Nurturer -  the nurturers excel in fostering warm relationships with all kinds of people, and spends a lot of attention on supporting and nurturing others. This can sometimes lead those within this subtype to feel entitled when it’s time for them to get their own needs met. They can at times have a prideful attitude about this, and a kind of false modesty, where the insistance on helping other firsts creates a kind of value.   Social: Ambition – The Ambassador - this subtype can value social approval and visible accomplishments as a way to get more self esteem. They can empathize and tune in to the needs of others to create a sense of importance, or even an indispensible role. For them, being allied with the right person in the right way, is more important than being at the centre of it all.  One-to-One: Seduction/Aggression – The Lover - this subtype uses warmth and attunement to others to make connections or deepn relationships and win the approval of a specific someone, even if just for a time. They can appear seductive in their body language and verbal tone, although not necessarily sexually so. At times this can appear as aggressive with demands for personal attention and affirmation.    TYPE 3 - THE PERFORMER Self-preservation: Security – The Company Man/Woman - With this subtype, a person’s ability to work hard, and perform at a high level an create a good image can be used to create material success. With all their commitment and energy, they can accomplish all sorts of things, including creating financial security, getting all the nice things, etc. but the risk is losing touch with who they really are in the process of it all, and becoming too identifiied with work.  Social: Prestige – The Politician - for this subtype the drive for achievement is geared towards winning social approval, and knowing the right people, getting the right kind of power in the right system or institution. This could be a kind of genuine social leadership, or more about self-aggrandizement through image curation. One-to-One: Femininity/Masculinity – The Movie Star - The ability to create the right image is about focusing on performing the gendered ideal. For example, they may try to create personal power by being attractive as a woman or man. But underneath it all their might be some confusion about their identity. People with this type tend to be more of a performer,  whether on stage, or in their day to day lives.    TYPE 4 - THE ROMANTIC Self-preservation: Dauntlessness – The Creative Individualist - people in this subtype tend to be willing to jump into new situations, get up and go, taks risks, or to take off when their preservation instinct gets activated, or when authenticity or an authentic life seems to be anywhere but here. To other poeple, they might seem reckless, careless, or without any caution, but this works well with a creative, artistic, or expressive lifestyle. For this type, they might have a tension between wanting to aquire material goods, and feeling disconnected from it all.  Social: Shame/Honor – The Critical Commentator - for people with this type, they may feel deficient based on what is happening in social situations, and can feel envious of others poeple with more social status, or who seem to belong. They likely want to establish an acceptable social role , possibly the one who is the truth teller about emotional content, and feels the need to resolve tension between the dsire to live authentically, and what is expected of them socially.  One-to-One: Competitiveness – The Dramatic Person - this subtype uses competition with others to overcome a sense of deficiency internally,  and create the drive to complete a personal agenda. They may see the power and strenghts of others as a challenge, and judge their own value, either the increase or decrease of their sense of their own worth, based on  comparison to others.    TYPE 8 - THE PROTECTOR  Self-preservation: Satisfactory Survival – The Survivalist - In this subtype, the Eight’s aggressiveness and excess are channeled into physical survival and material security. In a hostile world, the self-preservation Eight will either win or go down fighting. Fiercely protective of friends and family, this subtype can establish more territory and stockpile more supplies than anyone, but in a friendly world, may miss the boat altogether. Social: Friendship/Social Causes – The Group Leader/Gang Leader - A sense of powerlessness or injustice is overcome by being part of an aligned group, usually in a leadership role. This subtype’s anger and aggression are mediated by the group’s needs, and harnessed for a common agenda. Loyalty to friends and social causes take precedence over personal feelings and needs. One-to-One: Possession/Surrender – The Commander - A one-to-one Eight uses forcefulness and self-assertion to possess (or control) a partner or significant others. At times unable to adapt or let go, a strong enough yearning to be met fully can help this subtype let go of control and turn it over to a partner.   TYPE 9 - THE MEDIATOR Self-preservation: Appetite – The Collector - This subtype excels at creating the practical infrastructure and the daily rhythms that support instinctual life. But there is a tendency to fall asleep to personal needs or narcotize oneself with food and other kinds of material consumption. (They are often collectors.) A life of material abundance and comfort can preclude efforts toward personal or spiritual growth. Social: Participation – The Community Benefactor - Blending well with the style and priorities of their friends and different social networks, this subtype has the ability to be both a leader and a selfless supporter for the common good but can be numb to their personal priorities when in a comfortable social role  One-to-One: Union – The Seeker - This subtype has a longing to merge, either with a partner, nature or Spirit. This can be indiscriminate or heedless at times, but also can be a doorway into a transcendent state. In daily life, this can become problematic with keeping personal boundaries and focus, since it’s so easy to be pulled outside of oneself.   TYPE 1 - THE PERFECTIONIST  Self-preservation: Anxiety – The Pioneer - This subtype can be anxious or self controlled, but there is a focus on concerns about survival and security that get channeled into success. The focus here tends to be on being a good person, doing the right thing. This can be done by having control over nature, and imposing order. With this subtype, family life and the home, food prep, all the day to day things can take precedence over other needs. For these subtypes, too much self sacrifice can lead to tension in the body and resentment. Social: Inadaptability – The Social Reformer - Comfortable with a secure social role and a clear set of rules, this subtype is usually quite friendly and gregarious on one’s own turf. But an emphasis on doing things the right way can make it hard to adapt to new situations, and also can generate resentment or criticism toward others who may be acting “incorrectly.” One-to-One: Jealousy/Zealousness – The Evangelist - With clear rules and standards for correct behavior, this subtype keeps a highly charged instinctual center under strict self-control, leading at times to over zealousness in everything. Keeping a partner’s attention is vital to avoid self-recrimination. Jealousy toward a partner is common, and also may be experienced toward others who seem to have more room for self-expression. TYPE 2 - THE GIVER Self-preservation: Privilege – The Nurturer - Excelling in creating warm, personable relationships with many kinds of people, this subtype spends much attention on supporting and nurturing others, which can lead to a feeling of entitlement when it comes to getting one’s own needs met. This can contribute to a prideful attitude, or an insistence on going last that supports another kind of specialness, as in false modesty. Social: Ambition – The Ambassador - Gaining self-esteem through both social approval and visible accomplishments, this subtype empathizes and attunes to other’s needs to create an important, even indispensable role within an organization or cause. Being allied with the right people is usually more important than taking center stage. One-to-One: Seduction/Aggression – The Lover - This subtype uses all of the Two’s capacity for interpersonal attunement to make a connection and win the approval of selected people in a one-to-one relationship, even a brief one. The use of body language and feeling tones can be experienced as seductive, although not necessarily in a sexual sense. The same capacity also can show up in a more aggressive style that demands personal attention and recognition. TYPE 3 - THE PERFORMER Self-preservation: Security – The Company Man/Woman - With this subtype, the Three’s ability to work hard, perform well and maintain the right image are placed in the service of material success. With considerable drive and energy, this subtype can accomplish goals of financial security, a nice home, etc. The danger is losing contact with one’s real self in this effort, and becoming overly identified with one’s role at work. Social: Prestige – The Politician - The drive for success is directed toward winning social approval, knowing the right people, and achieving power in social institutions, whether in government, business or community groups. There can be genuine social leadership or simply self-aggrandizement through propaganda and image-making. One-to-One: Femininity/Masculinity – The Movie Star - The ability to create a successful image is focused on gender identity and issues. Personal power or charisma rests on being attractive as a woman or man. Yet underneath, there may be confusion about one’s real sexuality. This subtype tends to stay in the performer role, whether on stage or in personal relationships.   TYPE 4 - THE ROMANTIC Self-preservation: Dauntlessness – The Creative Individualist - This subtype is willing to jump into new situations, to pack up and move, to get going or take risks when the preservation instinct is triggered, or when an authentic life seems elsewhere. To others, these actions may seem reckless, like throwing caution to the wind, but it can work well with an unorthodox, creative or artistic style. The tension here is between wanting to acquire material security and feeling detached from it all. Social: Shame/Honor – The Critical Commentator - Feelings of deficiency can be provoked by social situations, with envy directed toward other people’s status or appearance of belonging. This subtype seeks to establish an acceptable social role, possibly as the emotional truth-teller for the group, and often feels a need to resolve the tension between the quest for individual authenticity and social expectations. One-to-One: Competitiveness – The Dramatic Person - Competition with others helps to overcome feelings of inner deficiency and create motivation for a personal agenda. This subtype takes the power or strength of others as a personal challenge, and one’s own value tends to rise and fall in comparison.   TYPE 5 - THE OBSERVER Self-preservation: Home – The Castle Defender - Home is the place wehre this subtype can retreat from the world and experience safety. This subtype is concerned about having enough supplies, which at times can lead to hoarding supplies. Or the opposite may be a true, with a lack in allegiance to any geographical location, living a nomadic life and traveling from place to place. . Social: Totem/Symbols – The Professor - This subtype has a passion for knowledge and mastery of the symbols and language of the group or society . But, this subtype can become trapped iwithin the framework of veing an observer,  with an over-emphasis on analysis and interpretation, which can get in the way of joining in or interacting with others. One-to-One: Confidentiality – The Secret Agent - This subtype will share confidences from the inner, private world in one-to-one relationships. This subtype has a kind of secretive quality and they can experience a tension between the need to connect with others and the need to guard their sense of autonomy.     TYPE 6 - THE LOYAL SKEPTIC  Self-preservation: Warmth – The Family Loyalist - this subtype navigates fear by making connectiosn and alliants with others through warmth , they do not want to be abandoned or rejected. But becuase of that,  when warmth is lacking or there isa threat to security early on in life it can create a sense of fear about takign risks and can cause a person to want to stay within secure boundaries.  Social: Duty – The Social Guardian - For this subtype, a priority is about being clear about one’s role in a group or society. To avoid rejection and overcome fear, this subtype likely wnat sto know the rules and have clarity in agreements with those they are in connection with, at work, or home. Being clear about one’s role in the group or society is an overriding concern. But with that here could also be some uncertainty about belonging. To do one’s duty can be both a blessing and a burden.   One-to-One: Strength or Beauty – The Warrior - This subtype actually has two styles: the first style can tend to overcome or avoid fear through force of will, and feats of strength , mastery, braverty, or  the ferocity of an ideological position. In the second style, insecurity and fear can be negotiated through channelling idealism and perceptivity into creating beauty. It’s important to note though that this is about creating stability and control.     TYPE 7 - THE EPICURE Self-preservation: Family – The Gourmand - This subtype likes to enjoy an abundant lifestyle within family and a circle of friends. The emphasis is on sharing good ideas and conversation, preparing elaborate meals or dining out, and planning fun projects. This subtype can have problems with over-talking, over-eating, and over-stimulation. Social: Limitation/Sacrifice – The Utopian Visionary - There is a tension here for theis subtype- they seem to need those around them to express their social idealism and intoxication with life. Giving themselves for the good of the group can feel like self sacrifice, and joining with those in the community can limit personal growth and planning for the future.    One-to-One: Suggestibility/Fascination – The Adventurer  -  This subtype can be influenced easily by the attractiveness of new ideas, people, adventures, that can get them caught up in the state of fascination. The one-to-one Seven can also influence others, and can use their charm and warmth to lead people into new paradigms, habits, relationships, ways of thinking, or activities.    TYPE 8 - THE PROTECTOR  Self-preservation: Satisfactory Survival – The Survivalist - In this subtype, the Eight’s aggressiveness and excess are channeled into physical survival and material security. In a hostile world, the self-preservation Eight will either win or go down fighting. Fiercely protective of friends and family, this subtype can establish more territory and stockpile more supplies than anyone, but in a friendly world, may miss the boat altogether. Social: Friendship/Social Causes – The Group Leader/Gang Leader - A sense of powerlessness or injustice is overcome by being part of an aligned group, usually in a leadership role. This subtype’s anger and aggression are mediated by the group’s needs, and harnessed for a common agenda. Loyalty to friends and social causes take precedence over personal feelings and needs. One-to-One: Possession/Surrender – The Commander - A one-to-one Eight uses forcefulness and self-assertion to possess (or control) a partner or significant others. At times unable to adapt or let go, a strong enough yearning to be met fully can help this subtype let go of control and turn it over to a partner.   TYPE 9 - THE MEDIATOR Self-preservation: Appetite – The Collector - This subtype excels at creating the practical infrastructure and the daily rhythms that support instinctual life. But there is a tendency to fall asleep to personal needs or narcotize oneself with food and other kinds of material consumption. (They are often collectors.) A life of material abundance and comfort can preclude efforts toward personal or spiritual growth. Social: Participation – The Community Benefactor - Blending well with the style and agenda of their friends and different social groups, this subtype can show great leadership and selfless contribution for the common good (on the high side) but tends to fall asleep to personal priorities in a comfortable social role or through indiscriminate activities (on the low side). One-to-One: Union – The Seeker - This subtype has a longing to merge, either with a partner, nature or Spirit. This can be indiscriminate or heedless at times, but also can be a doorway into a transcendent state. In daily life, this can become problematic with keeping personal boundaries and focus, since it’s so easy to be pulled outside of oneself.
September 12, 2019
It's ENNEAGRAM MADNESS. Today we have not one, not two, but three episodes about the Enneagram featuring one of our favorite teachers: Annie Dimond. This episode was sponsored by Betterhelp. Get 10% your first month of safe, private, affordable mental health counseling by visiting http://betterhelp.com/liturgists. Annie Dimond is a teacher of the Enneagram Personality and a PhD Student of Practical Theology at The University of Aberdeen in Scotland. In this episode, Annie and Mike McHargue dive deeper into the Enneagram by exploring its 27 subtypes and how it can act as a map for healing and self-acceptance.    To learn more about Annie Dimond, visit her website: enneagramforwholeness.com   For more about Ryan O'Neal and his music visit: sleepingatlast.com   To learn more about Enneagram Subtypes:  The Complete Enneagram: 27 Paths to Greater Self-Awareness by Beatrice Chestnut BRIEF DESCRIPTION OF CENTERS OF INTELLIGENCE AND PERCEPTION (enneagramworldwide.com)   8,9, 1 - Body or Gut Type Body-based types lead with the body for movement, sensate awareness and gut-level knowing. Their focus is on personal security, control, social belonging and taking right action. Also known as the Instinctual Center.   5,6,7 - Head Type Thinking-based, head types lead with ideas, gathering information, figuring things out and rational decision-making before acting. Their focus is on creating certainty and safety, or finding multiple options. Also known as the Intellectual Center. 2,3,4 - Heart Type Feeling-based types emphasize the heart for positive and negative feelings, empathy and concern for others, romance and devotion. Their focus is on success and relationship, performing up to expectations of the job or other people. Also known as the Emotional Center.   BRIEF DESCRIPTION OF THE SUBTYPES -  (enneagramworldwide.com)   Our evolution as human beings has required three basic survival strategies, known as the basic instincts: Self-preservation – responding to perceived threats and needs Social – creating social structures within communities One-to-one – primary relationships or coupling TYPE 2 - THE GIVER Self-preservation: Privilege – The Nurturer -  the nurturers excel in fostering warm relationships with all kinds of people, and spends a lot of attention on supporting and nurturing others. This can sometimes lead those within this subtype to feel entitled when it’s time for them to get their own needs met. They can at times have a prideful attitude about this, and a kind of false modesty, where the insistance on helping other firsts creates a kind of value.   Social: Ambition – The Ambassador - this subtype can value social approval and visible accomplishments as a way to get more self esteem. They can empathize and tune in to the needs of others to create a sense of importance, or even an indispensible role. For them, being allied with the right person in the right way, is more important than being at the centre of it all.  One-to-One: Seduction/Aggression – The Lover - this subtype uses warmth and attunement to others to make connections or deepn relationships and win the approval of a specific someone, even if just for a time. They can appear seductive in their body language and verbal tone, although not necessarily sexually so. At times this can appear as aggressive with demands for personal attention and affirmation.    TYPE 3 - THE PERFORMER Self-preservation: Security – The Company Man/Woman - With this subtype, a person’s ability to work hard, and perform at a high level an create a good image can be used to create material success. With all their commitment and energy, they can accomplish all sorts of things, including creating financial security, getting all the nice things, etc. but the risk is losing touch with who they really are in the process of it all, and becoming too identifiied with work.  Social: Prestige – The Politician - for this subtype the drive for achievement is geared towards winning social approval, and knowing the right people, getting the right kind of power in the right system or institution. This could be a kind of genuine social leadership, or more about self-aggrandizement through image curation. One-to-One: Femininity/Masculinity – The Movie Star - The ability to create the right image is about focusing on performing the gendered ideal. For example, they may try to create personal power by being attractive as a woman or man. But underneath it all their might be some confusion about their identity. People with this type tend to be more of a performer,  whether on stage, or in their day to day lives.    TYPE 4 - THE ROMANTIC Self-preservation: Dauntlessness – The Creative Individualist - people in this subtype tend to be willing to jump into new situations, get up and go, taks risks, or to take off when their preservation instinct gets activated, or when authenticity or an authentic life seems to be anywhere but here. To other poeple, they might seem reckless, careless, or without any caution, but this works well with a creative, artistic, or expressive lifestyle. For this type, they might have a tension between wanting to aquire material goods, and feeling disconnected from it all.  Social: Shame/Honor – The Critical Commentator - for people with this type, they may feel deficient based on what is happening in social situations, and can feel envious of others poeple with more social status, or who seem to belong. They likely want to establish an acceptable social role , possibly the one who is the truth teller about emotional content, and feels the need to resolve tension between the dsire to live authentically, and what is expected of them socially.  One-to-One: Competitiveness – The Dramatic Person - this subtype uses competition with others to overcome a sense of deficiency internally,  and create the drive to complete a personal agenda. They may see the power and strenghts of others as a challenge, and judge their own value, either the increase or decrease of their sense of their own worth, based on  comparison to others.    TYPE 8 - THE PROTECTOR  Self-preservation: Satisfactory Survival – The Survivalist - In this subtype, the Eight’s aggressiveness and excess are channeled into physical survival and material security. In a hostile world, the self-preservation Eight will either win or go down fighting. Fiercely protective of friends and family, this subtype can establish more territory and stockpile more supplies than anyone, but in a friendly world, may miss the boat altogether. Social: Friendship/Social Causes – The Group Leader/Gang Leader - A sense of powerlessness or injustice is overcome by being part of an aligned group, usually in a leadership role. This subtype’s anger and aggression are mediated by the group’s needs, and harnessed for a common agenda. Loyalty to friends and social causes take precedence over personal feelings and needs. One-to-One: Possession/Surrender – The Commander - A one-to-one Eight uses forcefulness and self-assertion to possess (or control) a partner or significant others. At times unable to adapt or let go, a strong enough yearning to be met fully can help this subtype let go of control and turn it over to a partner.   TYPE 9 - THE MEDIATOR Self-preservation: Appetite – The Collector - This subtype excels at creating the practical infrastructure and the daily rhythms that support instinctual life. But there is a tendency to fall asleep to personal needs or narcotize oneself with food and other kinds of material consumption. (They are often collectors.) A life of material abundance and comfort can preclude efforts toward personal or spiritual growth. Social: Participation – The Community Benefactor - Blending well with the style and priorities of their friends and different social networks, this subtype has the ability to be both a leader and a selfless supporter for the common good but can be numb to their personal priorities when in a comfortable social role  One-to-One: Union – The Seeker - This subtype has a longing to merge, either with a partner, nature or Spirit. This can be indiscriminate or heedless at times, but also can be a doorway into a transcendent state. In daily life, this can become problematic with keeping personal boundaries and focus, since it’s so easy to be pulled outside of oneself.   TYPE 1 - THE PERFECTIONIST  Self-preservation: Anxiety – The Pioneer - This subtype can be anxious or self controlled, but there is a focus on concerns about survival and security that get channeled into success. The focus here tends to be on being a good person, doing the right thing. This can be done by having control over nature, and imposing order. With this subtype, family life and the home, food prep, all the day to day things can take precedence over other needs. For these subtypes, too much self sacrifice can lead to tension in the body and resentment. Social: Inadaptability – The Social Reformer - Comfortable with a secure social role and a clear set of rules, this subtype is usually quite friendly and gregarious on one’s own turf. But an emphasis on doing things the right way can make it hard to adapt to new situations, and also can generate resentment or criticism toward others who may be acting “incorrectly.” One-to-One: Jealousy/Zealousness – The Evangelist - With clear rules and standards for correct behavior, this subtype keeps a highly charged instinctual center under strict self-control, leading at times to over zealousness in everything. Keeping a partner’s attention is vital to avoid self-recrimination. Jealousy toward a partner is common, and also may be experienced toward others who seem to have more room for self-expression. TYPE 2 - THE GIVER Self-preservation: Privilege – The Nurturer - Excelling in creating warm, personable relationships with many kinds of people, this subtype spends much attention on supporting and nurturing others, which can lead to a feeling of entitlement when it comes to getting one’s own needs met. This can contribute to a prideful attitude, or an insistence on going last that supports another kind of specialness, as in false modesty. Social: Ambition – The Ambassador - Gaining self-esteem through both social approval and visible accomplishments, this subtype empathizes and attunes to other’s needs to create an important, even indispensable role within an organization or cause. Being allied with the right people is usually more important than taking center stage. One-to-One: Seduction/Aggression – The Lover - This subtype uses all of the Two’s capacity for interpersonal attunement to make a connection and win the approval of selected people in a one-to-one relationship, even a brief one. The use of body language and feeling tones can be experienced as seductive, although not necessarily in a sexual sense. The same capacity also can show up in a more aggressive style that demands personal attention and recognition. TYPE 3 - THE PERFORMER Self-preservation: Security – The Company Man/Woman - With this subtype, the Three’s ability to work hard, perform well and maintain the right image are placed in the service of material success. With considerable drive and energy, this subtype can accomplish goals of financial security, a nice home, etc. The danger is losing contact with one’s real self in this effort, and becoming overly identified with one’s role at work. Social: Prestige – The Politician - The drive for success is directed toward winning social approval, knowing the right people, and achieving power in social institutions, whether in government, business or community groups. There can be genuine social leadership or simply self-aggrandizement through propaganda and image-making. One-to-One: Femininity/Masculinity – The Movie Star - The ability to create a successful image is focused on gender identity and issues. Personal power or charisma rests on being attractive as a woman or man. Yet underneath, there may be confusion about one’s real sexuality. This subtype tends to stay in the performer role, whether on stage or in personal relationships.   TYPE 4 - THE ROMANTIC Self-preservation: Dauntlessness – The Creative Individualist - This subtype is willing to jump into new situations, to pack up and move, to get going or take risks when the preservation instinct is triggered, or when an authentic life seems elsewhere. To others, these actions may seem reckless, like throwing caution to the wind, but it can work well with an unorthodox, creative or artistic style. The tension here is between wanting to acquire material security and feeling detached from it all. Social: Shame/Honor – The Critical Commentator - Feelings of deficiency can be provoked by social situations, with envy directed toward other people’s status or appearance of belonging. This subtype seeks to establish an acceptable social role, possibly as the emotional truth-teller for the group, and often feels a need to resolve the tension between the quest for individual authenticity and social expectations. One-to-One: Competitiveness – The Dramatic Person - Competition with others helps to overcome feelings of inner deficiency and create motivation for a personal agenda. This subtype takes the power or strength of others as a personal challenge, and one’s own value tends to rise and fall in comparison.   TYPE 5 - THE OBSERVER Self-preservation: Home – The Castle Defender - Home is the place wehre this subtype can retreat from the world and experience safety. This subtype is concerned about having enough supplies, which at times can lead to hoarding supplies. Or the opposite may be a true, with a lack in allegiance to any geographical location, living a nomadic life and traveling from place to place. . Social: Totem/Symbols – The Professor - This subtype has a passion for knowledge and mastery of the symbols and language of the group or society . But, this subtype can become trapped iwithin the framework of veing an observer,  with an over-emphasis on analysis and interpretation, which can get in the way of joining in or interacting with others. One-to-One: Confidentiality – The Secret Agent - This subtype will share confidences from the inner, private world in one-to-one relationships. This subtype has a kind of secretive quality and they can experience a tension between the need to connect with others and the need to guard their sense of autonomy.     TYPE 6 - THE LOYAL SKEPTIC  Self-preservation: Warmth – The Family Loyalist - this subtype navigates fear by making connectiosn and alliants with others through warmth , they do not want to be abandoned or rejected. But becuase of that,  when warmth is lacking or there isa threat to security early on in life it can create a sense of fear about takign risks and can cause a person to want to stay within secure boundaries.  Social: Duty – The Social Guardian - For this subtype, a priority is about being clear about one’s role in a group or society. To avoid rejection and overcome fear, this subtype likely wnat sto know the rules and have clarity in agreements with those they are in connection with, at work, or home. Being clear about one’s role in the group or society is an overriding concern. But with that here could also be some uncertainty about belonging. To do one’s duty can be both a blessing and a burden.   One-to-One: Strength or Beauty – The Warrior - This subtype actually has two styles: the first style can tend to overcome or avoid fear through force of will, and feats of strength , mastery, braverty, or  the ferocity of an ideological position. In the second style, insecurity and fear can be negotiated through channelling idealism and perceptivity into creating beauty. It’s important to note though that this is about creating stability and control.     TYPE 7 - THE EPICURE Self-preservation: Family – The Gourmand - This subtype likes to enjoy an abundant lifestyle within family and a circle of friends. The emphasis is on sharing good ideas and conversation, preparing elaborate meals or dining out, and planning fun projects. This subtype can have problems with over-talking, over-eating, and over-stimulation. Social: Limitation/Sacrifice – The Utopian Visionary - There is a tension here for theis subtype- they seem to need those around them to express their social idealism and intoxication with life. Giving themselves for the good of the group can feel like self sacrifice, and joining with those in the community can limit personal growth and planning for the future.    One-to-One: Suggestibility/Fascination – The Adventurer  -  This subtype can be influenced easily by the attractiveness of new ideas, people, adventures, that can get them caught up in the state of fascination. The one-to-one Seven can also influence others, and can use their charm and warmth to lead people into new paradigms, habits, relationships, ways of thinking, or activities.    TYPE 8 - THE PROTECTOR  Self-preservation: Satisfactory Survival – The Survivalist - In this subtype, the Eight’s aggressiveness and excess are channeled into physical survival and material security. In a hostile world, the self-preservation Eight will either win or go down fighting. Fiercely protective of friends and family, this subtype can establish more territory and stockpile more supplies than anyone, but in a friendly world, may miss the boat altogether. Social: Friendship/Social Causes – The Group Leader/Gang Leader - A sense of powerlessness or injustice is overcome by being part of an aligned group, usually in a leadership role. This subtype’s anger and aggression are mediated by the group’s needs, and harnessed for a common agenda. Loyalty to friends and social causes take precedence over personal feelings and needs. One-to-One: Possession/Surrender – The Commander - A one-to-one Eight uses forcefulness and self-assertion to possess (or control) a partner or significant others. At times unable to adapt or let go, a strong enough yearning to be met fully can help this subtype let go of control and turn it over to a partner.   TYPE 9 - THE MEDIATOR Self-preservation: Appetite – The Collector - This subtype excels at creating the practical infrastructure and the daily rhythms that support instinctual life. But there is a tendency to fall asleep to personal needs or narcotize oneself with food and other kinds of material consumption. (They are often collectors.) A life of material abundance and comfort can preclude efforts toward personal or spiritual growth. Social: Participation – The Community Benefactor - Blending well with the style and agenda of their friends and different social groups, this subtype can show great leadership and selfless contribution for the common good (on the high side) but tends to fall asleep to personal priorities in a comfortable social role or through indiscriminate activities (on the low side). One-to-One: Union – The Seeker - This subtype has a longing to merge, either with a partner, nature or Spirit. This can be indiscriminate or heedless at times, but also can be a doorway into a transcendent state. In daily life, this can become problematic with keeping personal boundaries and focus, since it’s so easy to be pulled outside of oneself.
September 12, 2019
It's ENNEAGRAM MADNESS. Today we have not one, not two, but three episodes about the Enneagram featuring one of our favorite teachers: Annie Dimond. This episode was sponsored by Betterhelp. Get 10% your first month of safe, private, affordable mental health counseling by visiting http://betterhelp.com/liturgists. Annie Dimond is a teacher of the Enneagram Personality and a PhD Student of Practical Theology at The University of Aberdeen in Scotland. In this episode, Annie and Mike McHargue dive deeper into the Enneagram by exploring its 27 subtypes and how it can act as a map for healing and self-acceptance.    To learn more about Annie Dimond, visit her website: enneagramforwholeness.com   For more about Ryan O'Neal and his music visit: sleepingatlast.com   To learn more about Enneagram Subtypes:  The Complete Enneagram: 27 Paths to Greater Self-Awareness by Beatrice Chestnut BRIEF DESCRIPTION OF CENTERS OF INTELLIGENCE AND PERCEPTION (enneagramworldwide.com)   8,9, 1 - Body or Gut Type Body-based types lead with the body for movement, sensate awareness and gut-level knowing. Their focus is on personal security, control, social belonging and taking right action. Also known as the Instinctual Center.   5,6,7 - Head Type Thinking-based, head types lead with ideas, gathering information, figuring things out and rational decision-making before acting. Their focus is on creating certainty and safety, or finding multiple options. Also known as the Intellectual Center. 2,3,4 - Heart Type Feeling-based types emphasize the heart for positive and negative feelings, empathy and concern for others, romance and devotion. Their focus is on success and relationship, performing up to expectations of the job or other people. Also known as the Emotional Center.   BRIEF DESCRIPTION OF THE SUBTYPES -  (enneagramworldwide.com)   Our evolution as human beings has required three basic survival strategies, known as the basic instincts: Self-preservation – responding to perceived threats and needs Social – creating social structures within communities One-to-one – primary relationships or coupling TYPE 2 - THE GIVER Self-preservation: Privilege – The Nurturer -  the nurturers excel in fostering warm relationships with all kinds of people, and spends a lot of attention on supporting and nurturing others. This can sometimes lead those within this subtype to feel entitled when it’s time for them to get their own needs met. They can at times have a prideful attitude about this, and a kind of false modesty, where the insistance on helping other firsts creates a kind of value.   Social: Ambition – The Ambassador - this subtype can value social approval and visible accomplishments as a way to get more self esteem. They can empathize and tune in to the needs of others to create a sense of importance, or even an indispensible role. For them, being allied with the right person in the right way, is more important than being at the centre of it all.  One-to-One: Seduction/Aggression – The Lover - this subtype uses warmth and attunement to others to make connections or deepn relationships and win the approval of a specific someone, even if just for a time. They can appear seductive in their body language and verbal tone, although not necessarily sexually so. At times this can appear as aggressive with demands for personal attention and affirmation.    TYPE 3 - THE PERFORMER Self-preservation: Security – The Company Man/Woman - With this subtype, a person’s ability to work hard, and perform at a high level an create a good image can be used to create material success. With all their commitment and energy, they can accomplish all sorts of things, including creating financial security, getting all the nice things, etc. but the risk is losing touch with who they really are in the process of it all, and becoming too identifiied with work.  Social: Prestige – The Politician - for this subtype the drive for achievement is geared towards winning social approval, and knowing the right people, getting the right kind of power in the right system or institution. This could be a kind of genuine social leadership, or more about self-aggrandizement through image curation. One-to-One: Femininity/Masculinity – The Movie Star - The ability to create the right image is about focusing on performing the gendered ideal. For example, they may try to create personal power by being attractive as a woman or man. But underneath it all their might be some confusion about their identity. People with this type tend to be more of a performer,  whether on stage, or in their day to day lives.    TYPE 4 - THE ROMANTIC Self-preservation: Dauntlessness – The Creative Individualist - people in this subtype tend to be willing to jump into new situations, get up and go, taks risks, or to take off when their preservation instinct gets activated, or when authenticity or an authentic life seems to be anywhere but here. To other poeple, they might seem reckless, careless, or without any caution, but this works well with a creative, artistic, or expressive lifestyle. For this type, they might have a tension between wanting to aquire material goods, and feeling disconnected from it all.  Social: Shame/Honor – The Critical Commentator - for people with this type, they may feel deficient based on what is happening in social situations, and can feel envious of others poeple with more social status, or who seem to belong. They likely want to establish an acceptable social role , possibly the one who is the truth teller about emotional content, and feels the need to resolve tension between the dsire to live authentically, and what is expected of them socially.  One-to-One: Competitiveness – The Dramatic Person - this subtype uses competition with others to overcome a sense of deficiency internally,  and create the drive to complete a personal agenda. They may see the power and strenghts of others as a challenge, and judge their own value, either the increase or decrease of their sense of their own worth, based on  comparison to others.    TYPE 8 - THE PROTECTOR  Self-preservation: Satisfactory Survival – The Survivalist - In this subtype, the Eight’s aggressiveness and excess are channeled into physical survival and material security. In a hostile world, the self-preservation Eight will either win or go down fighting. Fiercely protective of friends and family, this subtype can establish more territory and stockpile more supplies than anyone, but in a friendly world, may miss the boat altogether. Social: Friendship/Social Causes – The Group Leader/Gang Leader - A sense of powerlessness or injustice is overcome by being part of an aligned group, usually in a leadership role. This subtype’s anger and aggression are mediated by the group’s needs, and harnessed for a common agenda. Loyalty to friends and social causes take precedence over personal feelings and needs. One-to-One: Possession/Surrender – The Commander - A one-to-one Eight uses forcefulness and self-assertion to possess (or control) a partner or significant others. At times unable to adapt or let go, a strong enough yearning to be met fully can help this subtype let go of control and turn it over to a partner.   TYPE 9 - THE MEDIATOR Self-preservation: Appetite – The Collector - This subtype excels at creating the practical infrastructure and the daily rhythms that support instinctual life. But there is a tendency to fall asleep to personal needs or narcotize oneself with food and other kinds of material consumption. (They are often collectors.) A life of material abundance and comfort can preclude efforts toward personal or spiritual growth. Social: Participation – The Community Benefactor - Blending well with the style and priorities of their friends and different social networks, this subtype has the ability to be both a leader and a selfless supporter for the common good but can be numb to their personal priorities when in a comfortable social role  One-to-One: Union – The Seeker - This subtype has a longing to merge, either with a partner, nature or Spirit. This can be indiscriminate or heedless at times, but also can be a doorway into a transcendent state. In daily life, this can become problematic with keeping personal boundaries and focus, since it’s so easy to be pulled outside of oneself.   TYPE 1 - THE PERFECTIONIST  Self-preservation: Anxiety – The Pioneer - This subtype can be anxious or self controlled, but there is a focus on concerns about survival and security that get channeled into success. The focus here tends to be on being a good person, doing the right thing. This can be done by having control over nature, and imposing order. With this subtype, family life and the home, food prep, all the day to day things can take precedence over other needs. For these subtypes, too much self sacrifice can lead to tension in the body and resentment. Social: Inadaptability – The Social Reformer - Comfortable with a secure social role and a clear set of rules, this subtype is usually quite friendly and gregarious on one’s own turf. But an emphasis on doing things the right way can make it hard to adapt to new situations, and also can generate resentment or criticism toward others who may be acting “incorrectly.” One-to-One: Jealousy/Zealousness – The Evangelist - With clear rules and standards for correct behavior, this subtype keeps a highly charged instinctual center under strict self-control, leading at times to over zealousness in everything. Keeping a partner’s attention is vital to avoid self-recrimination. Jealousy toward a partner is common, and also may be experienced toward others who seem to have more room for self-expression. TYPE 2 - THE GIVER Self-preservation: Privilege – The Nurturer - Excelling in creating warm, personable relationships with many kinds of people, this subtype spends much attention on supporting and nurturing others, which can lead to a feeling of entitlement when it comes to getting one’s own needs met. This can contribute to a prideful attitude, or an insistence on going last that supports another kind of specialness, as in false modesty. Social: Ambition – The Ambassador - Gaining self-esteem through both social approval and visible accomplishments, this subtype empathizes and attunes to other’s needs to create an important, even indispensable role within an organization or cause. Being allied with the right people is usually more important than taking center stage. One-to-One: Seduction/Aggression – The Lover - This subtype uses all of the Two’s capacity for interpersonal attunement to make a connection and win the approval of selected people in a one-to-one relationship, even a brief one. The use of body language and feeling tones can be experienced as seductive, although not necessarily in a sexual sense. The same capacity also can show up in a more aggressive style that demands personal attention and recognition. TYPE 3 - THE PERFORMER Self-preservation: Security – The Company Man/Woman - With this subtype, the Three’s ability to work hard, perform well and maintain the right image are placed in the service of material success. With considerable drive and energy, this subtype can accomplish goals of financial security, a nice home, etc. The danger is losing contact with one’s real self in this effort, and becoming overly identified with one’s role at work. Social: Prestige – The Politician - The drive for success is directed toward winning social approval, knowing the right people, and achieving power in social institutions, whether in government, business or community groups. There can be genuine social leadership or simply self-aggrandizement through propaganda and image-making. One-to-One: Femininity/Masculinity – The Movie Star - The ability to create a successful image is focused on gender identity and issues. Personal power or charisma rests on being attractive as a woman or man. Yet underneath, there may be confusion about one’s real sexuality. This subtype tends to stay in the performer role, whether on stage or in personal relationships.   TYPE 4 - THE ROMANTIC Self-preservation: Dauntlessness – The Creative Individualist - This subtype is willing to jump into new situations, to pack up and move, to get going or take risks when the preservation instinct is triggered, or when an authentic life seems elsewhere. To others, these actions may seem reckless, like throwing caution to the wind, but it can work well with an unorthodox, creative or artistic style. The tension here is between wanting to acquire material security and feeling detached from it all. Social: Shame/Honor – The Critical Commentator - Feelings of deficiency can be provoked by social situations, with envy directed toward other people’s status or appearance of belonging. This subtype seeks to establish an acceptable social role, possibly as the emotional truth-teller for the group, and often feels a need to resolve the tension between the quest for individual authenticity and social expectations. One-to-One: Competitiveness – The Dramatic Person - Competition with others helps to overcome feelings of inner deficiency and create motivation for a personal agenda. This subtype takes the power or strength of others as a personal challenge, and one’s own value tends to rise and fall in comparison.   TYPE 5 - THE OBSERVER Self-preservation: Home – The Castle Defender - Home is the place wehre this subtype can retreat from the world and experience safety. This subtype is concerned about having enough supplies, which at times can lead to hoarding supplies. Or the opposite may be a true, with a lack in allegiance to any geographical location, living a nomadic life and traveling from place to place. . Social: Totem/Symbols – The Professor - This subtype has a passion for knowledge and mastery of the symbols and language of the group or society . But, this subtype can become trapped iwithin the framework of veing an observer,  with an over-emphasis on analysis and interpretation, which can get in the way of joining in or interacting with others. One-to-One: Confidentiality – The Secret Agent - This subtype will share confidences from the inner, private world in one-to-one relationships. This subtype has a kind of secretive quality and they can experience a tension between the need to connect with others and the need to guard their sense of autonomy.     TYPE 6 - THE LOYAL SKEPTIC  Self-preservation: Warmth – The Family Loyalist - this subtype navigates fear by making connectiosn and alliants with others through warmth , they do not want to be abandoned or rejected. But becuase of that,  when warmth is lacking or there isa threat to security early on in life it can create a sense of fear about takign risks and can cause a person to want to stay within secure boundaries.  Social: Duty – The Social Guardian - For this subtype, a priority is about being clear about one’s role in a group or society. To avoid rejection and overcome fear, this subtype likely wnat sto know the rules and have clarity in agreements with those they are in connection with, at work, or home. Being clear about one’s role in the group or society is an overriding concern. But with that here could also be some uncertainty about belonging. To do one’s duty can be both a blessing and a burden.   One-to-One: Strength or Beauty – The Warrior - This subtype actually has two styles: the first style can tend to overcome or avoid fear through force of will, and feats of strength , mastery, braverty, or  the ferocity of an ideological position. In the second style, insecurity and fear can be negotiated through channelling idealism and perceptivity into creating beauty. It’s important to note though that this is about creating stability and control.     TYPE 7 - THE EPICURE Self-preservation: Family – The Gourmand - This subtype likes to enjoy an abundant lifestyle within family and a circle of friends. The emphasis is on sharing good ideas and conversation, preparing elaborate meals or dining out, and planning fun projects. This subtype can have problems with over-talking, over-eating, and over-stimulation. Social: Limitation/Sacrifice – The Utopian Visionary - There is a tension here for theis subtype- they seem to need those around them to express their social idealism and intoxication with life. Giving themselves for the good of the group can feel like self sacrifice, and joining with those in the community can limit personal growth and planning for the future.    One-to-One: Suggestibility/Fascination – The Adventurer  -  This subtype can be influenced easily by the attractiveness of new ideas, people, adventures, that can get them caught up in the state of fascination. The one-to-one Seven can also influence others, and can use their charm and warmth to lead people into new paradigms, habits, relationships, ways of thinking, or activities.    TYPE 8 - THE PROTECTOR  Self-preservation: Satisfactory Survival – The Survivalist - In this subtype, the Eight’s aggressiveness and excess are channeled into physical survival and material security. In a hostile world, the self-preservation Eight will either win or go down fighting. Fiercely protective of friends and family, this subtype can establish more territory and stockpile more supplies than anyone, but in a friendly world, may miss the boat altogether. Social: Friendship/Social Causes – The Group Leader/Gang Leader - A sense of powerlessness or injustice is overcome by being part of an aligned group, usually in a leadership role. This subtype’s anger and aggression are mediated by the group’s needs, and harnessed for a common agenda. Loyalty to friends and social causes take precedence over personal feelings and needs. One-to-One: Possession/Surrender – The Commander - A one-to-one Eight uses forcefulness and self-assertion to possess (or control) a partner or significant others. At times unable to adapt or let go, a strong enough yearning to be met fully can help this subtype let go of control and turn it over to a partner.   TYPE 9 - THE MEDIATOR Self-preservation: Appetite – The Collector - This subtype excels at creating the practical infrastructure and the daily rhythms that support instinctual life. But there is a tendency to fall asleep to personal needs or narcotize oneself with food and other kinds of material consumption. (They are often collectors.) A life of material abundance and comfort can preclude efforts toward personal or spiritual growth. Social: Participation – The Community Benefactor - Blending well with the style and agenda of their friends and different social groups, this subtype can show great leadership and selfless contribution for the common good (on the high side) but tends to fall asleep to personal priorities in a comfortable social role or through indiscriminate activities (on the low side). One-to-One: Union – The Seeker - This subtype has a longing to merge, either with a partner, nature or Spirit. This can be indiscriminate or heedless at times, but also can be a doorway into a transcendent state. In daily life, this can become problematic with keeping personal boundaries and focus, since it’s so easy to be pulled outside of oneself.
September 5, 2019
This is an episode of our other podcast, The Alien & The Robot. It's a show for our Patrons, but this episode has some announcements about new stuff coming to Patreon PLUS we found a way to describe the "mission" of The Liturgists out loud for the first time ever. Not bad for a show that started in 2014.
August 22, 2019
Hillary McBride speaks with Audrey Assad about how fundamental religious cultures can foster, and even sometimes reward mental illnesses. In this episode Audrey shares about her experience battling Scrupulosity, or Religious OCD.
August 8, 2019
Michael Gungor sits down with Jamie Lee Finch to talk about embodiment, sexuality, and religious trauma. Jamie is a sexuality and embodiment coach, author, and poet. Michael Gungor and Science Mike are on tour. Click here to see if they're coming to a city near you.
July 25, 2019
Science Mike, Michael Gungor, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride discuss the modern epidemic of loneliness, and how to respond to it in an episode recorded in front of a live audience at the Wild Goose Festival 2019. We've got HUGE NEWS about our Tabs & Wafers tour: We're offering FREE TICKETS in all remaining cities in order to make our events more economically accessible. Plus, we're finally telling you the event actually is. You can learn more here. See you soon, Minneapolis, Chicago, Los Angeles, Tempe, San Francisco, Dallas, Houston, and Austin.
July 11, 2019
This episode is about prayer. What is prayer? What value, if any,  does prayer have for people who don't believe in a theistic God anymore? Science Mike and Michael Gungor are on tour and headed to a city near you.
June 20, 2019
Alabama recently approved a measure that would outlaw almost all abortions in the state, setting up a challenge to Roe v. Wade, the case that recognized a woman's constitutional right to end a pregnancy. Few issues are more divisive than abortion. Few topics push on our most fundamental ideas about life, personhood, and morality. Back in 2015, Rachel Held Evans, Science Mike, and Michael Gungor take a look a simple, controversial question: Are you pro-life or pro-choice? For more information on Rachel Held Evans’ work, and to learn how to support her family following her tragic passing, visit rachelheldevans.com You can get a free copy of one of Rachel’s audiobooks on Audible by signing up for a free trial Here.
May 21, 2019
In celebration of our 100th episode, we take a look at where the podcast has been while looking forward to what's next. Thank you to all of you who've listened and contributed over the years. Michael Gungor and Science Mike are going on tour in an event called Tabs & Wafers. Learn more.
May 2, 2019
In this episode, Michael Gungor asks leading theologians, scholars, teachers two questions: “Does God exist,” and “Who or what is God?”Guests on this episode include, Richard Rohr, Diana Butler Bass, Amy-Jill Levine, Sharon Salzberg, Reza Aslan, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride. Fr. Richard Rohr is a globally recognized ecumenical teacher bearing witness to the universal awakening within Christian mysticism and the Perennial Tradition. He is a Franciscan priest of the New Mexico Province and founder of the Center for Action and Contemplation (CAC) in Albuquerque, New Mexico. Fr. Richard’s teaching is grounded in the Franciscan alternative orthodoxy—practices of contemplation and self-emptying, expressing itself in radical compassion, particularly for the socially marginalized. Diana Butler Bass is an author, speaker, and independent scholar specializing in American religion and culture. She holds a Ph.D. in religious studies from Duke University and is the award-winning author of ten books, including Grounded: Finding God in the World —A Spiritual Revolution, Christianity After Religion: The End of Church and the Birth of a New Spiritual Awakening,  Christianity for the Rest of Us: How the Neighborhood Church is Transforming the Faith, and Grateful: The Transformative Power of Giving Thanks. Amy-Jill Levine is University Professor of New Testament and Jewish Studies, Mary Jane Werthan Professor of Jewish Studies, and Professor of New Testament Studies at Vanderbilt Divinity School and College of Arts and Science; she is also Affiliated Professor, Centre for the Study of Jewish-Christian Relations, Cambridge UK.   Her books include The Misunderstood Jew: The Church and the Scandal of the Jewish Jesus; The Meaning of the Bible: What the Jewish Scriptures and the Christian Old Testament Can Teach Us (co-authored with Douglas Knight); The New Testament, Methods and Meanings (co-authored with Warren Carter), and the thirteen-volume edited Feminist Companions to the New Testament and Early Christian Writing.  Her most recent volume is Short Stories by Jesus: The Enigmatic Parables of a Controversial Rabbi. She has also just written, with noted children’s book author Sandy Eisenberg Sasso, Who Counts? 100 Sheep, Ten Coins, and Two Sons (a volume on the parables of Luke 15, designed for children). Dr. Levine is also the co-editor, with Marc Z. Brettler, of the Jewish Annotated New Testament, now in a second edition.   Holding the B.A. from Smith College, and the M.A. and Ph.D. from Duke University, she has honorary doctorates from the University of Richmond, the Episcopal Theological Seminary of the Southwest, the University of South Carolina-Upstate, Drury University, Christian Theological Seminary, and Franklin College. A self-described Yankee Jewish feminist, Professor Levine is a member of Congregation Sherith Israel, an Orthodox Synagogue in Nashville, although she is often quite unorthodox. Sharon Salzberg is a central figure in the field of meditation, a world-renowned teacher and NY Times bestselling author. She has played a crucial role in bringing meditation and mindfulness practices to the West and into mainstream culture since 1974, when she first began teaching. She is the co-founder of the Insight Meditation Society in Barre, MA and the author of ten books including NY Times bestseller, Real Happiness, her seminal work, Lovingkindness and her forthcoming release by Flatiron Books, Real Love. Renowned for her down-to-earth teaching style, Sharon offers a secular, modern approach to Buddhist teachings, making them instantly accessible. She is a regular columnist for On Being, a contributor to Huffington Post, and the host of her own podcast: The Metta Hour. Reza Aslan is an internationally renowned writer, commentator, professor, producer, and scholar of religions. His books, including his #1 New York Times Bestseller, Zealot: The Life and Times of Jesus of Nazareth, have been translated into dozens of languages around the world. He is also a recipient of the prestigious James Joyce Award.
April 16, 2019
Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride talk with Michael Gungor about his newest book, THIS. As Michael shares, letting go of the stories that defined his identity and value in the world led him and his family on a wild and painful journey through atheism, mysticism, betrayal, loss, medical issues, moving trucks, and thousands of online trolls. The deconstruction of his faith is one story. The transformation of it is another. As Michael lets us know, our stories are the seams of illusion that we sew into reality―in order to label this and that. But what you think of as you (or anything else for that matter) is simply movement within the ocean of Being―of THIS. Once you see that is it just a story, you can let go and be free. You can get your copy of THIS on Amazon.com or, if you prefer audio books,  you can get THIS for free by signing up for an Audible trial using our affiliate link.
April 4, 2019
Hillary McBride and Science Mike talk about learning to cope with change, growth, and intimacy.Want to see Michael Gungor and Science Mike this May? Tickets for their summer tour are on sale now.
March 24, 2019
Hillary McBride, William Matthews, Science Mike, and Michael Gungor talk with Richard Rohr about The Universal Christ--Fr. Rohr’s latest book. You can learn more about the book here. You can get the audiobook for The Universal Christ for free using our Audible affiliate link. Learn more here.
March 7, 2019
We’re discussing fear in an episode that was recorded live at The Liturgists Gathering in Nashville, TN. Special thanks to Jamie Lee Finch for joining us. We’re going on tour! Join Science Mike and Michael Gungor for Tabs & Wafers. Tickets are on sale now--visit our events page for more information.
February 22, 2019
This week we're talking with Sharon Salzberg. Sharon is a central figure in the field of meditation, a world-renowned teacher and NY Times bestselling author. She has played a crucial role in bringing meditation and mindfulness practices to the West and into mainstream culture since 1974, when she first began teaching. She is the co-founder of the Insight Meditation Society in Barre, MA and the author of ten books including NY Times bestseller, Real Happiness, her seminal work, Lovingkindness and her forthcoming release by Flatiron Books, Real Love. Renowned for her down-to-earth teaching style, Sharon offers a secular, modern approach to Buddhist teachings, making them instantly accessible. She is a regular columnist for On Being, a contributor to Huffington Post, and the host of her own podcast: The Metta Hour. For more information, visit www.SharonSalzberg.com. We've got a handful of tickets left for our next kin retreat. If you're a man interested in confronting harmful cultural scripts around masculinity, we'd love for you to join us in Ojai this May.
February 7, 2019
We're talking with Bushi Yamato Damashii this week to kick off a new series on Buddhism. Bushi is a Buddhist monk and lead resident teacher at Daishin Zen Buddhist Temple in Thomasville, North Carolina. Bushi is also the Vice-president and Zen monk at Still Water Farms Retreat Center in Franklinville, NC. A former Christian minister and pastor, Bushi now speaks of much deeper understanding of the love and compassion of the Historical Jesus and the Historical Buddha. Bushi is classically trained in Mahayana Buddhism and Daishin Zen.
January 31, 2019
We've got another podcast called The Alien & The Robot that's available exclusively to our Patrons. But, as we work on Season 5, we've got some big news to share on multiple fronts. So, please enjoy a "behind the scenes" look at what The Liturgists are up to. Here's some links you may want: End of the World Tour  The Liturgists NEW SOCIAL PLATFORM
January 25, 2019
Propaganda, the Brilliance, and Gungor talk about their upcoming tour. Plus, Propaganda and Alma from the Red Couch Podcast tell us about their upcoming series on intersectionality, It's Complicated.
December 31, 2018
To close out Season 4 of The Liturgists Podcast, we look back at some of the highlights from The Liturgists Podcast so far (as selected by our community on Patreon). We're hiring an Associate Producer. You can learn more here.
November 29, 2018
In this episode, we talk about the story behind Kosmos, the latest record by William Matthews.
November 15, 2018
In the final episode of our Christian series, William Matthews tells Michael Gungor why he should be a Christian.
October 18, 2018
This week, Fr. Richard Rohr joins William Matthews, Michael Gungor, and Hillary McBride to explore the question: What is a Christian? We'd love to see you at The Liturgists Gathering in Minneapolis or Nashville this Novemeber.
October 4, 2018
This week Michael Gungor and Science Mike talk with Lisa Gungor and Jenny McHargue about what Christianity is. We'd love to see you at The Liturgists Gathering in London, Minneapolos, or Nashville this year.
September 27, 2018
This is the first in a weekly series where we explore two seemingly simple questions: "Do you identify as a Christian," and, "Why or why not."Our guest on this episode is Jennifer Knapp. We'll be in London, Minneapolis and Nashville for The Liturgists Gathering this fall. We'd love to see you there.
September 20, 2018
This is the first in a weekly series where we explore two seemingly simple questions: "Do you identify as a Christian," and, "Why or why not."Our guest on this episode is Rachel Held Evans. Her new book about the Bible is called Inspired. We'll be in London, Minneapolis and Nashville for The Liturgists Gathering this fall. We'd love to see you there.
September 6, 2018
Here's a sample of our latest project: a new weekly podcast for folks who support us on Patreon called The Alien & The Robot.
July 26, 2018
As a followup to Woman, this episode explores masculinity and male identity in a culture striving for equality.
July 12, 2018
This podcast was recorded at The Liturgists Gathering in Austin, TX.If you're interested in hosting The Liturgists Gathering, let us know.
June 25, 2018
In this episode, we're talking about Lisa Gungor's new book, called The Most Beautiful Thing I've Seen.
May 31, 2018
A look at how social media impacts advocay, mental health, community building, and our view of the world.
May 18, 2018
As we gear up for The Liturgists Gathering in Austin, TX, here's a bonus episode from our Patreon podcast.
May 3, 2018
Hillary, William, Michael, and Mike discuss spirtulity beyond the reach of language.
April 19, 2018
This episode is about the spiritual gift of speaking in tongues, as explored through the perspectives of science, art, and faith.
April 5, 2018
TRIGGER WARNING: The interview with Christopher West in Part 2 could be triggering to members of the LGBTQIA+ community. It's included so people with non-affiriming viewpoints on LGBTQIA+ on sexuality are prompted to examine the implications of that worldview, but we encourge our listners to use discretion before listening to that segment.   In this episode, we’re talking about how to discern what is right and healthy for people in sexual activity.   We’d like to thank our guests on this episode, and we encourage you to check out their work.   Bromliegh McCleneghan, Author of Good Christian Sex Darren Calhoun, Artist and Speaker Christopher West, Author, Speaker, Teacher and Expert in John Paul II’s Theology of the Body Caroline Lee, Artist and Photographer Jamie Lee Finch, Relationship Guide, Intuitive Healer Lisa Gungor, Artist and Author
April 5, 2018
In this episode, we’re talking about how to discern what is right and healthy for people in sexual activity.   We’d like to thank our guests on this episode, and we encourage you to check out their work.   Bromliegh McCleneghan, Author of Good Christian Sex Darren Calhoun, Artist and Speaker Christopher West, Author, Speaker, Teacher and Expert in John Paul II’s Theology of the Body Caroline Lee, Artist and Photographer Jamie Lee Finch, Relationship Guide, Intuitive Healer Lisa Gungor, Artist and Author
March 22, 2018
In this episode, we’re discussing body image–how we view our bodies and the bodies of others.   For more, check out Hillary’s book.
March 8, 2018
Who are you? Is the body a transport vessel for the brain? This episode tackles the idea of emboidment, and our complex relationships with our own bodies.
February 22, 2018
What does it mean to be an Evangelical today? We talk with Matthew Vines from The Reformation Project as well as author/speaker Jen Hatmaker about Evangelicalism in 2018.
February 8, 2018
On this episode, we welcome two new hosts to the podast: William Matthews and Hillary McBride. Plus, we uncover the hottest new band in worship music, Abraham's Bosom.
January 20, 2018
This is a bonus episode with a Loving Kindness meditation. May you find that it promotes healing in difficult times. If you'd like to try more meditations like these, join us on Patreon. If you'd like to learn more about meditation as a practice, consider our new online course about meditaiton.
December 5, 2017
This is a special live episode recorded at The Liturigsts Gathering in Seattle, WA on October 27, 2017. Thanks Hillary McBride for joining us on this episode. Her new book is available now. Special Announcement: We're starting something new next year for those of you who want to go deeper with topics we discuss on The Liturgists Podcast via video courses. If you'd like to get access to these first, you can  preorder the first two for the price of one here.
October 31, 2017
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
October 17, 2017
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
October 3, 2017
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
August 15, 2017
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
August 1, 2017
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
July 11, 2017
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
June 20, 2017
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
June 6, 2017
In this episode, Michael Gungor and Science Mike discuss the relationship between violence and Christianity with Shane Claiborne.   Check out Shane’s new book, Executing Grace.
May 16, 2017
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
April 9, 2017
A liturgy for the beginnging of Holy Week.If you'd like a daily resource for all of holy week, join us on Patreon.
March 21, 2017
How can we engage in effective advocacy that creates change? And how can we do so without losing hope? We talked to two experts in the world of social justice and advocacy to find out.   Christena Cleveland is a social psychologist, public theologian, author and professor. She is the first Associate Professor of the Practice of Reconciliation at Duke University’s Divinity School and the author of Disunity in Christ: Uncovering the Hidden Forces that Keep Us Apart. You can learn more about her at http://www.christenacleveland.com   Micky is a perpetual learner, “justice doula”, consultant, facilitator, mama/sister/friend, nonviolence practitioner and contemplative activist living just south of Nashville, TN. After 10 plus years as a mother-baby specialist, trainer and author, she decided to shift back to earlier interests: theology and community development. She is a member of the co-learning community of NAIITS (North American Institute of Indigenous Theological Studies) and graduated with a Masters of Arts in Intercultural Studies. Learn more about her at http://www.mickyscottbeyjones.com
March 7, 2017
What’s fake news, and how can we spot it? This episode is about media literacy, and offers insights on how to spot fake news, as well as media bias, and skewed data.   We talked with Clay Johnson, author of The Information Diet and the co-founder of Blue State Digital, the firm that built and managed Barack Obama’s online campaign for the presidency in 2008.   Here’s a few resources to dig deeper:   How to tell fake news from real news - TED Ed How to Spot Fake News - FactCheck.org
March 1, 2017
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
February 21, 2017
We're talking about epistemology on this episode–the study of truth, belief, and justification. Sound boring? In the age of "fake news," this may be the most important topic we can cover.
February 7, 2017
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
January 24, 2017
As a follow-up to Lost & Found and The Other Side of the Mattress, we respond to our most common request: an episode on how to talk to your kids during and after faith transitions.
December 20, 2016
A special Christmas episode featuring highlights from our friends The Brilliance.
November 29, 2016
This is the third episode of a three part series dealing with suffering: what is it, how do we cope with it, and how can we address it? Please consider joining with us to help provide clean drinking water to every person on this planet. Learn more at http://theliturgists.com/water
November 15, 2016
This is the second in a three part series dealing with suffering: what is it, how do we cope with it, and how can we address it? Please consider joining with us to help provide clean drinking water to every person on this planet. Learn more at http://theliturgists.com/water
November 1, 2016
This is the first in a three part series dealing with suffering: what is it, how do we cope with it, and how can we address it? Please consider joining with us to help provide clean drinking water to every person on this planet. Learn more at http://theliturgists.com/water
October 7, 2016
We've got a special series of podcasts this week exploring the themes and sounds of Gungor's new record One Wild Life: Body. This is the final album in the One Wild Life trilogy of records, and is available everywhere music is sold.   Learn more at gungormusic.com.
October 6, 2016
We've got a special series of podcasts this week exploring the themes and sounds of Gungor's new record One Wild Life: Body. This is the final album in the One Wild Life trilogy of records, and is available everywhere music is sold.   Learn more at gungormusic.com.
October 5, 2016
We've got a special series of podcasts this week exploring the themes and sounds of Gungor's new record One Wild Life: Body. This is the final album in the One Wild Life trilogy of records, and is available everywhere music is sold.   Learn more at gungormusic.com.
October 4, 2016
We've got a special series of podcasts this week exploring the themes and sounds of Gungor's new record One Wild Life: Body. This is the final album in the One Wild Life trilogy of records, and is available everywhere music is sold. Learn more at gungormusic.com.
October 3, 2016
We've got a special series of podcasts this week exploring the themes and sounds of Gungor's new record One Wild Life: Body. This is the final album in the One Wild Life trilogy of records, and is available everywhere music is sold. Learn more at gungormusic.com.
September 27, 2016
In this episode, we explore the sexism in the context of culture and the church. Featuring Austin Channing Brown, Caroline Lee, Christine Chester, Emily Capshaw, Lisa Gungor, and Rev. Sarah Heath.
September 13, 2016
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
September 6, 2016
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
August 23, 2016
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
July 19, 2016
While we work on Season 3, here's a special live episode of The Liturgists Podcast recorded at the Wild Goose Festival. It's a conversation between Science Mike, Michael Gungor, and a live audience. If you'd like to be part of a conversation like this, join us at The Liturgists Gathering.
April 12, 2016
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
March 29, 2016
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
March 8, 2016
Science Mike talks with Lisa and Michael Gungor about their new album, One Wild Life Soul.   We'd love to see you at The Liturgists Gathering or the One Wild Life Tour.
February 23, 2016
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
February 9, 2016
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
January 19, 2016
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
December 15, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
November 24, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
November 3, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
October 20, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
October 6, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
September 22, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
September 8, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
August 25, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
June 30, 2015
Science Mike sat down with Michael Gungor and Lisa Gungor to talk about their new project One Wild Life: Soul following Belong. One Wild Life: Soul comes out in August, but you can get it now for a limited time as part of the One Wild Life Season Pass. One Wild Life is a trilogy of records being released this year, and the Season Pass gets you all three before anyone else–including One Wild Life: Soul immediately. See gungormusic.com for more details.
May 19, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
May 5, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
April 21, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
April 7, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
March 24, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
March 10, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
February 24, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
February 10, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
January 27, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
January 13, 2015
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
December 23, 2014
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
November 25, 2014
Michael Gungor, Science Mike, William Matthews, and Hillary McBride host a culture-shaping, genre-bending conversation about the most relevant (or bizarre) topics facing people today.
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