Andrea Heinz and Michelle Abel interview Linda MacDonald and Jeanne Sarson, two survivors, nurses, and the originators of the term and movement against “non-state torture” (NST). Linda and Jeanne explain how “torture” relates to prostitution, porn, trafficking and intimate partner violence. They discuss the battle for the recognition of NST and its application to men’s violence against women and girls in places like the UN, as well as the resistance, even from many women. They finish on paths of healing even from extreme trauma and that a fulfilling life after abuse is not impossible.
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