In this episode, I talk with Mark about what criteria he uses to program choral music. We also chat about going outside the harmonic structures of the Common Practice Period, the XVIIII and XIX centuries, and how a convincing music can be achieved by other means. We also talk about consonance and dissonance in contemporary music and we listen to an exceprt from Stuart Greenbaum's "Brought to Light" and from Donald Grantham "La Canción Desesperada" on a poem by Pablo Neruda, as performed under Mark Shapiro's baton by Cantori New York. It is one of our longer episodes because, well, there was a lot to talk about.