John Butterfield and I talk about flipping counters and some of the games he has been working on, his continued work on Chad Jensen's game Downfall and his new game ON Hells Highway an update of a classic.He also talks about what he looks for is a publisher.https://www.gmtgames.com/p-944-downfall-conquest-of-the-third-reich-1942-1945.aspxhttps://sdhist.com/https://sdhist.com/sdhist-con-2022/https://sdhist.com/conflicts-of-interest-zine/https://sdhist.com/summit-award/