Thom’s Nutshell:Rigorous honesty begins at home.Joe C. joins us to discuss the ways relapse is experienced by the loved ones of the relapser, and how we can think about these distressing events differently. The universe isn’t guided by structure and order alone. There’s chaos as well. We have influence, but not control, and with emotional sobriety we can more clearly see that distinction.Thank you for listening to our podcast. Our music is provided by the great southern artist Jefferson Ross. Learn more about Jefferson at jeffersonross.com Visit our website:www.emotionalsobriety.infoFollow us on social media:Instagram: thomrutledge2Joe C. Twitter: @Rebellion_DogsLearn more about Joe C., Secular AA and Rebellion Dogs here:https://rebelliondogspublishing.com  Friendly Circle Berlin workshops: https://friendlycircleberlin.org/events Allen’s book, 12 Essential Insights for Emotional Sobriety: https://www.amazon.com/12-Essential-Insights-Emotional-Sobriety/dp/1955415129/ Join Allen & Thom at our Thursday night, 7pm PST Zoom meeting on Emotional Sobriety and the Steps (login information below): https://zoom.us/j/330149513Password: 375986 For our ongoing workshop video series on Emotional Sobriety and the 12 Steps, visit our YouTube channel here:https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCHEM2-kqLkfp3I4c0jy-X-g Also, please join our “Emotional Sobriety and Recovery” FB Group at the following link:https://www.facebook.com/groups/120450976662519We’d love to stay in touch in between meetings. We appreciate feedback! Contact Patrick, our producer, at [email protected] for any questions or comments.