On episode 13 of Data Renegades, CL Kao sits down with Josh Wills to explore how AI agents are reshaping software engineering, data science, and data infrastructure. They discuss verification, benchmarking, pre-training data pipelines, multimodal AI, and why understanding a problem may matter more than writing code. Josh also shares lessons learned from decades of building large-scale data systems and his journey from management back to hands-on engineering.