Instead of “Spiritual Bypassing” (a term coined by Robert Augustus Masters, with the same title as a book), avoiding seemingly “negative” emotions, what does a healthy integration of peak experiences and difficult emotions mean?

We finish our conversation noting that maybe best meditation can be understood as a interwoven sequence of waking up (to the original nature of the mind), growing up (in the various aspects of us being human), cleaning up (taking care of our personal mess) and showing up (making a difference with what we want to see in the world).