Laurie Lawrence's obsession with winning Gold started when he was a small boy growing up above the Tobruk Pool in Townsville. When he became a coach, he had an epiphany about the nature of victory.When Laurie was a child, he had a chronic lung condition that meant he had to sleep sitting in a chair.Doctors advised his parents that an operation was necessary, and part of one of his lungs was removed.After the operation, Laurie's father took over the management of Townsville's Tobruk Pool, and the family lived in an apartment overlooking the lanes. In 1956 the Australian Olympic team came to the pool to train there.A short time later, Laurie's mother fled the marriage and took her children to live in Brisbane where she ran a boarding house 'full of inebriates'.Laurie grew up to become a teacher, and won a place on the Australian Rugby Team. Then he moved back to Townsville to start a new career as a swimming coach.In 1970, a 13-year-old girl Laurie was coaching named Helen Gray won a silver medal at the Queensland Championships.When she presented him with it, Laurie spat on the medal and threw it over the pool fence. What he did that day eventually saw him ask himself big questions about the meaning of victory in the pool.Learn more about Laurie Lawrence at his website.Read about Laurie resources and programs to keep kids safe in the water: Kids Alive is supported by the Federal Government; World Wide Swim School is for teachers, parents, coaches and swim schools.Laurie has also released a new online interactive baby swimming resource.This episode of Conversations was produced by Nicola Harrison. Executive Producer was Carmel Rooney.It explores sports, sporting life of Australia, being competitive, Australian Olympic team, drownings in Australia, why everyone learns to swim in Australia, equitable access to water, winning at all costs, learning to swim, when should my child learn to swim, Australian icons. Rugby Union, Wallabies, Australian sporting icons, water safety, water education, pool gates.To binge even more great episodes of the Conversations podcast with Richard Fidler and Sarah Kanowski go the ABC listen app (Australia) or wherever you get your podcasts. There you’ll find hundreds of the best thought-provoking interviews with authors, writers, artists, politicians, psychologists, musicians, and celebrities.