Show notes
Gretchen Evans served 27 years in the US Army, earning a bronze star, and rising to the rank of Command Sergeant Major. During her service, Gretchen survived a rocket blast which left her with hearing loss and a traumatic brain injury. While struggling with depression after her injury, she relied on a new rope team to bring her back into the world and show her she still had the ability to find purpose by serving and leading again. Despite her injuries, Gretchen serves others as a passionate volunteer. She also achieved her No Barriers goal by finishing her book, “Leading from the Front.”On this episode of our No Barriers Podcast we connected with Gretchen remotely from her home in North Carolina. Showing her Army roots, Gretchen was early to the call and well-prepared, including with adaptive technology to communicate since she is deaf.The episode begins with Gretchen detailing her time in the Army, her many tours, and her overall love for the service.“I’ve done 9 Combat tours...I’m like a cat with 9 lives.”She was a natural leader and despite her very small frame she was a commanding force and was dedicated to her troops. After an unexpected rocket blast, Gretchen was devastated when she woke up in the hospital and learned she would never hear again.“The thing that really kicked me in the gut wasn’t even my physical injuries, what made me pause, made me afraid, was that I went from zero to hero in one second with no transition and no plan for retirement...that I wasn’t going out on my own terms.”As she was forced back into civilian life with a disability she struggled to figure out her new role. She describes the hopelessness and despair that can take over your life as a hole:“I had tried therapy, medication and those things somewhat helped but they weren’t the silver bullet. I wanted out of this hole. I was clinging to the sides to keep from falling in.”Eventually, Gretchen talks about finding No Barriers Warriors, the No Barriers programs for Veterans and on her first expedition out into the wilderness she discovers that it's not her disability that's been holding her back, it's her disconnection from other people. Being around other Veterans and having a team is what Gretchen was missing.She talks about how that was the catalyst to rediscovering her purpose - to lead teams and help others. She was still a leader at heart, just in a different capacity.“First you gotta realize you have a hole, having self awareness, and letting people into your life - realizing that helping other people - and engaging with other people who have their own holes- that’s healing.”Buy a copy of Gretchen's book: Leading From the FrontLearn more about No Barriers WarriorsTRANSCRIPTErik: This is our No Barriers podcast. This is Erik Weihenmayer talking [Jeff: Good, Erik. Good, Erik. It seems to be another shorts and t-shirts day here in the middle of winter in Colorado. Everything is going as not planned for our winter, but it's still a beautiful day here in Colorado.Erik: Dumped 12 inches yesterday I heard up in the mountains so maybe things are looking up. We're not getting much of a winter. I didn't [Jeff: This half winter that we got here has been challenging for me, outdoor [Erik: It's gonna be so fun. I can't wait. I don't get into the field as much as I'd like with our group. We're gonna be leading a youth group to Nepal and we have kids signed up of all abilities, not just kids with [Jeff: Gretchen has ... probably within the past [Erik: Gretchen, you served for 27 years serving our country. That's a long time. [Gretchen: Initially, honestly, it was just out of survival. I lost both of my parents when I was a teenager. I was attempting to become financially self-supportive. It just became really difficult. The military offered a job and training and income [Jeff: You were telling me, Gretchen, you met your husband. I [Gretchen: Yeah, so my husband, Robert, was a navy chaplain in '06. He was sent to Afghanistan to be in charge of all the chaplains in Afghanistan. At the time, I was the senior command sergeant major in Afghanistan of all the installations. Everything good and bad came [Jeff: Yeah, yeah.Erik: I love that.Jeff: The fact that you feel in love in the sandbox and then developed and cultivated this relationship and it was all prior to your injury, that says a lot about the character of both of you and what you've been through.Erik: [Gretchen: Absolutely. I agree totally.Jeff: Tell us a little bit, Gretchen, about the journey that led you to that day and give us a sense of [Erik: And people don't know that you had nine combat tours.Gretchen: It started in Granada. I jumped into Granada and did Panama and Central America, [inaudible Jeff: Was it the ninth when the incident took place?Gretchen: Yeah, the last one. That was that one. What happened that day was I was flying around in my helicopter [When I got to [inaudible Honestly, the thing that really kicked me in the gut wasn't even my physical injuries. What kicked my in the gut and made me pause [Erik: What's that like? No Barriers is a lit about understanding these processes that we go through. What is that like being a hero one minute and then a zero in the next? What's going in your brain, all the [Gretchen: The experience for me was I just didn't have a path any longer. I was just kind of like, "What now?" Toppled with these injuries, I just thought, "Nobody's gonna want me. I'm not ever gonna work again. How am I gonna communicate with people." [Jeff: I've heard you say as well because remember I heard you speak in Ashville and you talked about losing your family and your fellowship and your mission. When you say [Gretchen: Yeah, my team, my soldiers. I had been with them my whole adult life. If you think about it, I went in right after I turned 19 and I was 46 years old. My entire, almost, adult life had been spent in uniform with troops. I was not prepared for the civilian world. I'm still kind of a little bit of a crappy civilian to be honest. [Jeff: Do you also think that there are certain people that get [Gretchen: Yeah, very true. Especially as a sergeant major because our rank is very special. We're supposed to be the advocate for the troop. [Jeff: It sounds to me like, Gretchen, you went through all of these different phases of emotion following your injury that we always hear so much about all the way from anger to frustration to sadness to [Gretchen: It was really very a strange thing. I had kept in touch with some of my troops. We don't have to say a lot for people to know that something's not right. It's like a sixth sense almost. One of my guys wrote to me. He says, "You know, sergeant major, [Part of the process is that the physician [Erik: You're perfect.Gretchen: You're exactly what we're looking for.Erik: You're perfect.Gretchen: You're perfect.Erik: That's right. You're perfectly imperfect just like the rest of us. That's beautiful.Gretchen: It was beautiful.Erik: Okay, you got accepted into the program. I'm just curious about what it was like to be with some colleagues because, [Gretchen: At this point, really my physical injuries were what they were. I made accommodations to all the technology out there to help me with my hearing issue, my brain injury same with that. My real issue was [We hiked and we talked and I felt like all of a sudden, that hole started filling up with just good things. The despair that I been feeling and the hopelessness, little by little with each step as I was walking up those mountains started to dissipate. It turned the corner for me. There was some healing afterwards. I still wake up every day and not [Erik: I thought that was interesting. This is Erik, Gretchen. You talked about a hole and then you start to fill up that hole. Do you think that's what healing ultimately is? There's a lot of people listening probably that are experiencing a loss or getting stuck somewhere [Gretchen: What it looked like for me is first you gotta realize that you got a hole. The first step in getting better is self-awareness. I knew I had a hole, but it became really obvious to me how deep and wide it was when I got on the expedition. [Erik: Cool. Where did that lead you after that trip? You graduate and then you make a No Barriers pledge. Tell us about that amazing pledge [Gretchen: I had to think about this pledge. There's lots of things that I could've pledged but I had been working on this book that really came out of putting down the stories of 27 years of serving with the most heroic men and women I've ever met in my life. It's really about the troops. It's written from my perspective but it's these wonderful stories about them. My pledge was the finish the [Jeff: Do you consider yourself a writer? I think a lot of people ... Erik and I have both written books. I think some people would say, "I'm a writer. I enjoy the process because in a way, it's a little bit therapeutic." Did you find that through the case or was it a struggle or did you despise the process or did [Gretchen: When I was writing it, I wasn't thinking I was writing it ... I was writing it to help heal myself because I was writing about things that happen. When you put it down on paper, you have to remember better. Sometimes your brain plays tricks on you. When you write it down, I had to explain what it smelled like and what it sounded like and why Sergeant so-and- [Jeff: Why did you call it Leading From the Front? I've seen books and people talk about leading from behind and leading from every direction. Why did you call it Leading From the Front? Is that an allusion to the frontline? What is that?Gretchen: In lots of ways, that title resonated with me. One, always try [Erik: I think that's your wiring, Gretchen. You're just absolutely wired. One takeaway from you is you were born to lead and when that got taken from you, you have to find a different outlet for you. I so applaud the idea of [Gretchen: [Also, I help my husband in his job. His hospital serves 10,000 veterans every week or so. Just advising him sometimes on the way that soldiers think and what's important to them. I'm a good person for him to come home to and say, "I had this situation. What would you suggest would be best way to handle this," and try to [Erik: A lot of this conversation, Gretchen, has been about leadership and service. You served for 27 years in the military and then this thing happens to you, this thing of great loss. You're still leading. In a way, [Gretchen: Absolutely, I have no regrets. You know what? It made me a better leader, absolutely. I really had to dig deep and I had to understand and try even harder to be empathetic and sympathetic [Erik: You certainly are.Jeff: You truly are [Erik: I think it's all of us in the No Barriers community [Jeff: Yeah.Erik: And it's gonna be fun trekking across the Tibetan Plateau with you in June, Gretchen. Looking forward to that experience. Thanks for being with us today.Gretchen: That you both for your kind words and for having me on your program and for all that you do. I'm gonna keep plugging along until I get to the finished line and I'm exhausted. Yes, Erik, it will [Jeff: Thanks, Gretchen.Erik: Alright, cool. Hey, Jeff, that was an awesome interview. A lot of takeaways-Jeff: I just continue to be blown away by how the definition of a No Barriers participant continues to grow in my mind. I've been with you since the beginning [Erik: I think it's [Jeff: And the fact that ... I find it so profound that this woman literally was probably a child and knew she was going to be of service to other people. You can just tell it. It's just in her genetic [Erik: Still building that map. I love it. Anyway, thank you. It was an awesome interview. If people want to learn more about No Barriers, go to nobarriersusa.org. We have a lot of events coming up. We have our What's Your Everest event out here in Colorado. We got a summit coming up in October [